From jari.bakken at gmail.com  Sat Jan  1 00:15:26 2011
From: jari.bakken at gmail.com (Jari Bakken)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 06:15:26 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Cleaning up Watir API: style() method
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimu_Ao3aVW33=kyzfK+Y=jidEB9aO3DcEg3j3KP@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=XC3pZ_cG8AcxM0-=oDk_mghsOqs1B4WzCY83Y@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim70Gz3NAfgOn78mBNLTTjLvjP3-64ZsFHexG_-@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimu_Ao3aVW33=kyzfK+Y=jidEB9aO3DcEg3j3KP@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=G1ZxwsDrumOv1P4cd2e7gDw_UajrzQ7=zdmUo@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 5:14 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> I want to verify that I understand the proposal.
>
> Is the suggestion that the Watir-WebDriver API be added to the IE driver in
> addition to the existing API? Or will it replace it, creating backwards
> incompatability?
>

To clarify, currently watir-webdriver does this:

1. If the #style method is passed an argument, return the value of the
given property (e.g. 'background-image').
2. If #style is invoked with no argument and the receiving element has
a 'style' property, return the string value of that property.
3. If #style is invoked with no argument and the receiving element
does not have a 'style' property, return an empty string.

Watir returns the COM style object.

I think the best solution for Watir would be to do something like this
(untested):

def style(property = nil)
  assert_exists

  if property
    object.currentStyle.send(camel_case_css(property))
  else
    object.currentStyle
  end
end

This way the migration path for people switching to watir-webdriver
will be easier (i.e. always pass an argument), but it's not a
significant break in backwards compatibility (where no one is passing
an argument).

From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  1 00:13:32 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 23:13:32 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
Message-ID: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>

Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are attending
from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days would
work best for you?

Bret

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com

Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From alister.scott at gmail.com  Sat Jan  1 00:32:36 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 15:32:36 +1000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikn=vC=m=mk8OKH8N_T5rMWt3ZQPTGZPo79atEa@mail.gmail.com>

The Sunday before (3rd April) suits me best.

Thanks,
Alister

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 3:13 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:

> Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
> the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
> not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are attending
> from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days would
> work best for you?
>
> Bret
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  1 00:56:46 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 23:56:46 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Cleaning up Watir API: style() method
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=G1ZxwsDrumOv1P4cd2e7gDw_UajrzQ7=zdmUo@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=XC3pZ_cG8AcxM0-=oDk_mghsOqs1B4WzCY83Y@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim70Gz3NAfgOn78mBNLTTjLvjP3-64ZsFHexG_-@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimu_Ao3aVW33=kyzfK+Y=jidEB9aO3DcEg3j3KP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=G1ZxwsDrumOv1P4cd2e7gDw_UajrzQ7=zdmUo@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimVnc3VV0Dc3=6t0GT5A52g4SeGMWXOPxRt=6GD@mail.gmail.com>

I have no objections to this change. I am unsure how popular this feature is
in the first place.

Bret

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 11:15 PM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 5:14 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> wrote:
> > I want to verify that I understand the proposal.
> >
> > Is the suggestion that the Watir-WebDriver API be added to the IE driver
> in
> > addition to the existing API? Or will it replace it, creating backwards
> > incompatability?
> >
>
> To clarify, currently watir-webdriver does this:
>
> 1. If the #style method is passed an argument, return the value of the
> given property (e.g. 'background-image').
> 2. If #style is invoked with no argument and the receiving element has
> a 'style' property, return the string value of that property.
> 3. If #style is invoked with no argument and the receiving element
> does not have a 'style' property, return an empty string.
>
> Watir returns the COM style object.
>
> I think the best solution for Watir would be to do something like this
> (untested):
>
> def style(property = nil)
>  assert_exists
>
>  if property
>    object.currentStyle.send(camel_case_css(property))
>  else
>    object.currentStyle
>  end
> end
>
> This way the migration path for people switching to watir-webdriver
> will be easier (i.e. always pass an argument), but it's not a
> significant break in backwards compatibility (where no one is passing
> an argument).
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com

Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jari.bakken at gmail.com  Sat Jan  1 07:30:13 2011
From: jari.bakken at gmail.com (Jari Bakken)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 13:30:13 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=rCAvapnw2u3aZ4VMp6czr9szPKfuZJdHUqDcT@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
> the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
> not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are attending
> from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days would
> work best for you?
>

April 3rd would work, or at least some day *before* SeConf. The way
things look now I'll have to leave for Norway on the 7th.

From simon.m.stewart at gmail.com  Sat Jan  1 08:30:42 2011
From: simon.m.stewart at gmail.com (Simon Stewart)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 13:30:42 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTintRMnkbgEd2YucnjKj5RZvciMYC=cueKmGFpgP@mail.gmail.com>

Any room for non-watir committers?

Simon

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 5:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
> the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
> not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are attending
> from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days would
> work best for you?
>
> Bret
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From charley.baker at gmail.com  Sat Jan  1 12:04:10 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 10:04:10 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTintRMnkbgEd2YucnjKj5RZvciMYC=cueKmGFpgP@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTintRMnkbgEd2YucnjKj5RZvciMYC=cueKmGFpgP@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinj32tiNL=h7P49e11V7gTOX=LyViCpfhc9ueUN@mail.gmail.com>

Absolutely! The intention is to focus on Watir that day, everyone's
invited, we're also excited about attending SeConf though it's been a
while since a lot of us have worked with Selenium. We're hoping to use
the same space if it's available, I'll send a note to the SeConf
mailing list and see if that's a possibility.

Happy New Year! :)

Charley

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 6:30 AM, Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com> wrote:
> Any room for non-watir committers?
>
> Simon
>
> On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 5:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
>> Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
>> the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
>> not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are attending
>> from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days would
>> work best for you?
>>
>> Bret
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From charley.baker at gmail.com  Sat Jan  1 12:06:19 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 10:06:19 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] Cleaning up Watir API: style() method
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimVnc3VV0Dc3=6t0GT5A52g4SeGMWXOPxRt=6GD@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=XC3pZ_cG8AcxM0-=oDk_mghsOqs1B4WzCY83Y@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim70Gz3NAfgOn78mBNLTTjLvjP3-64ZsFHexG_-@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimu_Ao3aVW33=kyzfK+Y=jidEB9aO3DcEg3j3KP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=G1ZxwsDrumOv1P4cd2e7gDw_UajrzQ7=zdmUo@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimVnc3VV0Dc3=6t0GT5A52g4SeGMWXOPxRt=6GD@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikd_njKGyRi1rOdENwJZQZ9zeoTbwQ58V7PXYwV@mail.gmail.com>

Looks like a good suggestion. I've seen this question come up
occasionally on the mailing list and have used it myself to determine
whether a DOM element is displayed or not as well as a few other
times.

-c

On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 10:56 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> I have no objections to this change. I am unsure how popular this feature is
> in the first place.
>
> Bret
>
> On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 11:15 PM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 31, 2010 at 5:14 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
>> wrote:
>> > I want to verify that I understand the proposal.
>> >
>> > Is the suggestion that the Watir-WebDriver API be added to the IE driver
>> > in
>> > addition to the existing API? Or will it replace it, creating backwards
>> > incompatability?
>> >
>>
>> To clarify, currently watir-webdriver does this:
>>
>> 1. If the #style method is passed an argument, return the value of the
>> given property (e.g. 'background-image').
>> 2. If #style is invoked with no argument and the receiving element has
>> a 'style' property, return the string value of that property.
>> 3. If #style is invoked with no argument and the receiving element
>> does not have a 'style' property, return an empty string.
>>
>> Watir returns the COM style object.
>>
>> I think the best solution for Watir would be to do something like this
>> (untested):
>>
>> def style(property = nil)
>> ?assert_exists
>>
>> ?if property
>> ? ?object.currentStyle.send(camel_case_css(property))
>> ?else
>> ? ?object.currentStyle
>> ?end
>> end
>>
>> This way the migration path for people switching to watir-webdriver
>> will be easier (i.e. always pass an argument), but it's not a
>> significant break in backwards compatibility (where no one is passing
>> an argument).
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  1 12:31:40 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2011 11:31:40 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTintRMnkbgEd2YucnjKj5RZvciMYC=cueKmGFpgP@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTintRMnkbgEd2YucnjKj5RZvciMYC=cueKmGFpgP@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikDNUuUUCOkMjptoy5vR9Cubk4r_nfaAggqq2hH@mail.gmail.com>

I've been chatting with Charley about the SeConf and I see that that will
have two primary audiences. One will be the Selenium developers and the
other will be Selenium users. Since it is in the mutual interest of both
BrowserMob and SauceLabs, I think their will be a big push for presentations
that will show people how to use Selenium and that they will be discouraging
Watir material that might have the effect of putting doubts into the minds
of people who might otherwise be disposed to go with Selenium. This is my
guess, partly based on the dynamics of the principals.

I don't want to fight this, but would like to take advantage of the fact
that we'll have most of the Watir development team in one place. So rather
than fight for space in the official SeConf conference for Watir-specific
technical insidery stuff -- I would rather just set up something on the
side.

Sounds like Sunday April 3rd will be a good day for this. I would like to
make this an open meeting to other Watir users and Selenium developers and
users, but the Watir development team would set the agenda.

Bret

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 7:30 AM, Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com>wrote:

> Any room for non-watir committers?
>
> Simon
>
> On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 5:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> wrote:
> > Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
> > the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
> > not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are
> attending
> > from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days
> would
> > work best for you?
> >
> > Bret
> >
> > --
> > Bret Pettichord
> > Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
> >
> > Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
> > Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Mon Jan  3 05:08:58 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 11:08:58 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Fwd: Donate to Watir
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimeqt3hqJdgKvzfaTwe31hZk3T9rMpV8iSYtJD9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <f81b1251003010351y1778ef30ma96a7c9c31d5c1cd@mail.gmail.com>
	<x2pf81b1251004020329iad00eecr2df849a29df94914@mail.gmail.com>
	<x2zf81b1251005060548iffbe8474p3ea7c196f1296e96@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinf0AEVOXLbaTEEkM4aUp9CSAdB8jgqAx8Vlnx4@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimeqt3hqJdgKvzfaTwe31hZk3T9rMpV8iSYtJD9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinm_VjL5wR7Vir=kH_KrQyOvJO1MgOxtsATY3gs@mail.gmail.com>

If you like the Watir project, you can make a donation. There is donate
button at http://watir.com/.

We've raised $695 last year. We will spend it on hosting and stuff like
that.

You can see list of donors and Bret's thank you note at
http://pledgie.com/campaigns/2982

?eljko
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Mon Jan  3 05:16:36 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 11:16:36 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=bXO0SucAp3_bCGBWmF0ZEZkLxX_R4ObgbAUkr@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> Can those of you who are attending from overseas or have already made
travel plans please share what days would work best for you?

I did not make any travel plans, I am fine with any date.

?eljko
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Mon Jan  3 05:20:03 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 11:20:03 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikBsCqtsJLCUetLwDW58NLxkuUzu=vf5ELtwSTV@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
the Watir developers can meet to discuss things

Since SeConf is in April, do you think there will still be a need for Watir
Conference in Zagreb in June?

?eljko
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From watirjira at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 10:59:19 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Jonas Shoor (JIRA))
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 09:59:19 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-456) Firewatir fails to
	start firefox
In-Reply-To: <11156732.1179.1286512593133.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <760299.978.1294070359980.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-456?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20075#action_20075 ] 

Jonas Shoor commented on WTR-456:
---------------------------------

I found that firewatir was not able to start firefox on windows with ruby 1.9.2 as well. 

Changing line 72 in firefox.rb from:
@t = Thread.new { system("#{bin} -jssh #{profile_opt}") }
to:
@t = Thread.new { system(bin, '-jssh',  profile_opt) }

seems to resolve the problem.


> Firewatir fails to start firefox
> --------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-456
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-456
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: FireWatir
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.5
>         Environment: ruby 1.8.6, 1.9.1 and ruby 1.9.2 mingw from http://rubyinstaller.org/
>            Reporter: Kevin DeRossett
>            Priority: Critical
>
> path_from_registry in firefox.rb line 1027ish
> is:
> return entry.last
> but should be:
> return "\"#{entry.last}\""
> without the quotes firefox will not start from the path c:\Program Files\... or c:\Program Files (x86)\... the default location.

-- 
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 13:05:45 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 20:05:45 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
Message-ID: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>

In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified API
between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API like this:

browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
browser.clear # removes all cookies
browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
browser.delete new_cookie

#<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood correctly
with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other implementations
so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe just
"name".

Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the limitations
of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object already
then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as a
requirement.

I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related with
cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And nothing for
FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject and free
to change, i guess.

What are other's thoughts about the matter?

Jarmo
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From jari.bakken at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 13:58:26 2011
From: jari.bakken at gmail.com (Jari Bakken)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 19:58:26 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified API
> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API like this:
> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
> browser.clear # removes all cookies
> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
> browser.delete new_cookie
> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood correctly
> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other implementations
> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe just
> "name".

You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.

I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
cookies look like this:

{
  :name => "foo",
  :value => "bar",
  :path => "/some/path",
  :domain => "some.domain",
  :expires => DateTime,
  :secure  => true/false
}

When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
:path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
(valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).

A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects the
current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it will
raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
(artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.

Jari










> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the limitations
> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object already
> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as a
> requirement.
> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related with
> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And nothing for
> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject and free
> to change, i guess.
> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
> Jarmo
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From charley.baker at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 14:36:41 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 12:36:41 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] Fwd:  Watir day at SeConf
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikDNUuUUCOkMjptoy5vR9Cubk4r_nfaAggqq2hH@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTikBXp1CQvxheE=Q7HNZbaunqz6=Ksebjk2QoRRf@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTintRMnkbgEd2YucnjKj5RZvciMYC=cueKmGFpgP@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikDNUuUUCOkMjptoy5vR9Cubk4r_nfaAggqq2hH@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=KbRCCJutdZ9K-NUQTTYg6URr6Q_oc55BHO4ac@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

 I'm forwarding this email from Bret about some conversations we've
had to this list. While many of the core Watir devs/community
managers, etc are planning on coming out for SeConf, we also want to
have a day where we focus on Watir development. As Bret mentions, the
Sunday before looks like the best time for many of our devs who are
coming from various continents to attend.

 In spirit, this is similar to the way that the JRuby team piggybacked
onto RubyConf '09 in SF. It's a good complimentary conference with a
slightly different focus.

 The main question is, can we get the same space for the day before
SeConf kicks off? I'm not sure who's working on the location
logistics, but hopefully we can work together on setting this up.
There are obviously other questions that we'll have to figure out -
submissions, the format, cost, etc. I'd like to get the organizational
part settled and then we can talk about that.

Let me know if that makes sense or you have questions.

Cheers,

Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com




---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
Date: Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: [Wtr-development] Watir day at SeConf
To: Watir development <wtr-development at rubyforge.org>


I've been chatting with Charley about the SeConf and I see that that
will have two primary audiences. One will be the Selenium developers
and the other will be Selenium users. Since it is in the mutual
interest of both BrowserMob and SauceLabs, I think their will be a big
push for presentations that will show people how to use Selenium and
that they will be discouraging Watir material that might have the
effect of putting doubts into the minds of people who might otherwise
be disposed to go with Selenium. This is my guess, partly based on the
dynamics of the principals.

I don't want to fight this, but would like to take advantage of the
fact that we'll have most of the Watir development team in one place.
So rather than fight for space in the official SeConf conference for
Watir-specific technical insidery stuff -- I would rather just set up
something on the side.

Sounds like Sunday April 3rd will be a good day for this. I would like
to make this an open meeting to other Watir users and Selenium
developers and users, but the Watir development team would set the
agenda.

Bret

On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 7:30 AM, Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Any room for non-watir committers?
>
> Simon
>
> On Sat, Jan 1, 2011 at 5:13 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> > Charley and I would would like to find a day during the SeConf week where
> > the Watir developers can meet to discuss things that the Se Community may
> > not care about. Or at least a half day. Can those of you who are attending
> > from overseas or have already made travel plans please share what days would
> > work best for you?
> >
> > Bret
> >
> > --
> > Bret Pettichord
> > Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
> >
> > Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
> > Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development



--
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord


_______________________________________________
Wtr-development mailing list
Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development

From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 14:59:25 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 21:59:25 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=s1x_BV_1ODcgOYW_2YJrNYYRezH0G=zXHO5WB@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 8:58 PM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:

> You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
> Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
>

Yes, that's exactly what i meant. Thank you for correcting.



>
> I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
> will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation).


Makes sense to me too.



> Jari
>

Jarmo
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 15:11:22 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 13:11:22 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>

That sounds like a good general API. Watir has had the CookieManager
trailing around for a while as a contributed component. I'm not sure
how many people use it, but it's a bit weak and is more of an addon
than truly integrated into the core API which it should be. I've
hacked around that area a bit for some of the gap common domains, and
cookie refreshes.

I'd like to get more feedback from users, as this is a fairly common
case. I'll ping a few people as well, since the Gap uses various
toplevel domains and redirection but some common cookies across
domains for a type of SSO. A lot of the cookie work there was visiting
custom urls for refreshing/deleting. FB had something similar.

This is a good idea to incorporate cookie management more cleanly, and
the api looks good. Next steps imho, let's figure out who if anyone is
using the CookieManager, and deprecate that. Pull a few use cases from
some companies that are doing a lot cookie management, write some
tests and implement.

Thoughts?


Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified API
>> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API like this:
>> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
>> browser.clear # removes all cookies
>> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
>> browser.delete new_cookie
>> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood correctly
>> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
>> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other implementations
>> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe just
>> "name".
>
> You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
> Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
>
> I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
> will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
> way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
> cookies look like this:
>
> {
> ?:name => "foo",
> ?:value => "bar",
> ?:path => "/some/path",
> ?:domain => "some.domain",
> ?:expires => DateTime,
> ?:secure ?=> true/false
> }
>
> When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
> :path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
> the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
> (valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).
>
> A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects the
> current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it will
> raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
> clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
> reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
> light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
> (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
> can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.
>
> Jari
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the limitations
>> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object already
>> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as a
>> requirement.
>> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related with
>> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And nothing for
>> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject and free
>> to change, i guess.
>> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
>> Jarmo
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 15:16:39 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 22:16:39 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTim1=FY4GiqtoRsnN=vBtNn6SapGkbs5LDs26tLa@mail.gmail.com>

As a sidenote, deprecating CookieManager can be a totally independent thing
since currently nothing loads it automatically in Watir. So if someone is
using it then they had to load it manually. I'd say that makes it even more
doubtful that it's used. But who knows. Just don'd deprecate it before
there's some real implementation :)

Jarmo

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 10:11 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:

> That sounds like a good general API. Watir has had the CookieManager
> trailing around for a while as a contributed component. I'm not sure
> how many people use it, but it's a bit weak and is more of an addon
> than truly integrated into the core API which it should be. I've
> hacked around that area a bit for some of the gap common domains, and
> cookie refreshes.
>
> I'd like to get more feedback from users, as this is a fairly common
> case. I'll ping a few people as well, since the Gap uses various
> toplevel domains and redirection but some common cookies across
> domains for a type of SSO. A lot of the cookie work there was visiting
> custom urls for refreshing/deleting. FB had something similar.
>
> This is a good idea to incorporate cookie management more cleanly, and
> the api looks good. Next steps imho, let's figure out who if anyone is
> using the CookieManager, and deprecate that. Pull a few use cases from
> some companies that are doing a lot cookie management, write some
> tests and implement.
>
> Thoughts?
>
>
> Charley Baker
> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified API
> >> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API like
> this:
> >> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
> >> browser.clear # removes all cookies
> >> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
> >> browser.delete new_cookie
> >> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood correctly
> >> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
> >> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other
> implementations
> >> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe
> just
> >> "name".
> >
> > You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
> > Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
> >
> > I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
> > will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
> > way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
> > cookies look like this:
> >
> > {
> >  :name => "foo",
> >  :value => "bar",
> >  :path => "/some/path",
> >  :domain => "some.domain",
> >  :expires => DateTime,
> >  :secure  => true/false
> > }
> >
> > When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
> > :path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
> > the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
> > (valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).
> >
> > A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects the
> > current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it will
> > raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
> > clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
> > reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
> > light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
> > (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
> > can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.
> >
> > Jari
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the
> limitations
> >> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object
> already
> >> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as a
> >> requirement.
> >> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related with
> >> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And nothing
> for
> >> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject and
> free
> >> to change, i guess.
> >> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
> >> Jarmo
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wtr-development mailing list
> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 16:39:28 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:39:28 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim1=FY4GiqtoRsnN=vBtNn6SapGkbs5LDs26tLa@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim1=FY4GiqtoRsnN=vBtNn6SapGkbs5LDs26tLa@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin1NLyw=EXUBdDFQusLeBPoZQZKWnwRrLOLpMzD@mail.gmail.com>

Yep, of course. My only thought there was to deprecate it, since it is
a bit old and untested, as well as ping the watir general list and
find out who's using it, and make sure we cover the base use cases as
well as inviting people in for however they may have extended it. I'll
send an email to that effect now.

Cheers,

Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 1:16 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> As a sidenote, deprecating CookieManager can be a totally independent thing
> since currently nothing loads it automatically in Watir. So if someone is
> using it then they had to load it manually. I'd say that makes it even more
> doubtful that it's used. But who knows. Just don'd deprecate it before
> there's some real implementation :)
> Jarmo
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 10:11 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> That sounds like a good general API. Watir has had the CookieManager
>> trailing around for a while as a contributed component. I'm not sure
>> how many people use it, but it's a bit weak and is more of an addon
>> than truly integrated into the core API which it should be. I've
>> hacked around that area a bit for some of the gap common domains, and
>> cookie refreshes.
>>
>> I'd like to get more feedback from users, as this is a fairly common
>> case. I'll ping a few people as well, since the Gap uses various
>> toplevel domains and redirection but some common cookies across
>> domains for a type of SSO. A lot of the cookie work there was visiting
>> custom urls for refreshing/deleting. FB had something similar.
>>
>> This is a good idea to incorporate cookie management more cleanly, and
>> the api looks good. Next steps imho, let's figure out who if anyone is
>> using the CookieManager, and deprecate that. Pull a few use cases from
>> some companies that are doing a lot cookie management, write some
>> tests and implement.
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>>
>> Charley Baker
>> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified
>> >> API
>> >> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API like
>> >> this:
>> >> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
>> >> browser.clear # removes all cookies
>> >> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
>> >> browser.delete new_cookie
>> >> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood
>> >> correctly
>> >> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
>> >> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other
>> >> implementations
>> >> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe
>> >> just
>> >> "name".
>> >
>> > You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
>> > Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
>> >
>> > I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
>> > will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
>> > way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
>> > cookies look like this:
>> >
>> > {
>> > ?:name => "foo",
>> > ?:value => "bar",
>> > ?:path => "/some/path",
>> > ?:domain => "some.domain",
>> > ?:expires => DateTime,
>> > ?:secure ?=> true/false
>> > }
>> >
>> > When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
>> > :path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
>> > the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
>> > (valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).
>> >
>> > A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects the
>> > current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it will
>> > raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
>> > clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
>> > reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
>> > light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
>> > (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
>> > can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.
>> >
>> > Jari
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the
>> >> limitations
>> >> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object
>> >> already
>> >> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as a
>> >> requirement.
>> >> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related with
>> >> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And nothing
>> >> for
>> >> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject and
>> >> free
>> >> to change, i guess.
>> >> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
>> >> Jarmo
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Wtr-development mailing list
>> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From bret at pettichord.com  Mon Jan  3 17:12:22 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 16:12:22 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin1NLyw=EXUBdDFQusLeBPoZQZKWnwRrLOLpMzD@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim1=FY4GiqtoRsnN=vBtNn6SapGkbs5LDs26tLa@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin1NLyw=EXUBdDFQusLeBPoZQZKWnwRrLOLpMzD@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinf8xDtv=j1m4LFSS2pQyppmyMZap=W2tb6qFXO@mail.gmail.com>

By deprecate do you mean

 (a) remove it; or
 (b) cause to issue a deprecation warning when required?

Bret

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:39 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:

> Yep, of course. My only thought there was to deprecate it, since it is
> a bit old and untested, as well as ping the watir general list and
> find out who's using it, and make sure we cover the base use cases as
> well as inviting people in for however they may have extended it. I'll
> send an email to that effect now.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Charley Baker
> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 1:16 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> > As a sidenote, deprecating CookieManager can be a totally independent
> thing
> > since currently nothing loads it automatically in Watir. So if someone is
> > using it then they had to load it manually. I'd say that makes it even
> more
> > doubtful that it's used. But who knows. Just don'd deprecate it before
> > there's some real implementation :)
> > Jarmo
> >
> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 10:11 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> That sounds like a good general API. Watir has had the CookieManager
> >> trailing around for a while as a contributed component. I'm not sure
> >> how many people use it, but it's a bit weak and is more of an addon
> >> than truly integrated into the core API which it should be. I've
> >> hacked around that area a bit for some of the gap common domains, and
> >> cookie refreshes.
> >>
> >> I'd like to get more feedback from users, as this is a fairly common
> >> case. I'll ping a few people as well, since the Gap uses various
> >> toplevel domains and redirection but some common cookies across
> >> domains for a type of SSO. A lot of the cookie work there was visiting
> >> custom urls for refreshing/deleting. FB had something similar.
> >>
> >> This is a good idea to incorporate cookie management more cleanly, and
> >> the api looks good. Next steps imho, let's figure out who if anyone is
> >> using the CookieManager, and deprecate that. Pull a few use cases from
> >> some companies that are doing a lot cookie management, write some
> >> tests and implement.
> >>
> >> Thoughts?
> >>
> >>
> >> Charley Baker
> >> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified
> >> >> API
> >> >> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API
> like
> >> >> this:
> >> >> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
> >> >> browser.clear # removes all cookies
> >> >> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
> >> >> browser.delete new_cookie
> >> >> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood
> >> >> correctly
> >> >> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
> >> >> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other
> >> >> implementations
> >> >> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe
> >> >> just
> >> >> "name".
> >> >
> >> > You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
> >> > Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
> >> >
> >> > I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
> >> > will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
> >> > way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
> >> > cookies look like this:
> >> >
> >> > {
> >> >  :name => "foo",
> >> >  :value => "bar",
> >> >  :path => "/some/path",
> >> >  :domain => "some.domain",
> >> >  :expires => DateTime,
> >> >  :secure  => true/false
> >> > }
> >> >
> >> > When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
> >> > :path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
> >> > the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
> >> > (valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).
> >> >
> >> > A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects the
> >> > current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it will
> >> > raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
> >> > clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
> >> > reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
> >> > light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
> >> > (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
> >> > can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.
> >> >
> >> > Jari
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the
> >> >> limitations
> >> >> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object
> >> >> already
> >> >> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as
> a
> >> >> requirement.
> >> >> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related
> with
> >> >> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And nothing
> >> >> for
> >> >> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject and
> >> >> free
> >> >> to change, i guess.
> >> >> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
> >> >> Jarmo
> >> >> _______________________________________________
> >> >> Wtr-development mailing list
> >> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >> >>
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Wtr-development mailing list
> >> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >> >
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wtr-development mailing list
> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 17:20:39 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 00:20:39 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinf8xDtv=j1m4LFSS2pQyppmyMZap=W2tb6qFXO@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim1=FY4GiqtoRsnN=vBtNn6SapGkbs5LDs26tLa@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin1NLyw=EXUBdDFQusLeBPoZQZKWnwRrLOLpMzD@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinf8xDtv=j1m4LFSS2pQyppmyMZap=W2tb6qFXO@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinLXzEppPL-UnxmR0U2gXh=oSiLamM96PQryGh2@mail.gmail.com>

I'd suggest first (b) and then (a). Least harm done.

Jarmo

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 12:12 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> By deprecate do you mean
>
>  (a) remove it; or
>  (b) cause to issue a deprecation warning when required?
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:39 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Yep, of course. My only thought there was to deprecate it, since it is
>> a bit old and untested, as well as ping the watir general list and
>> find out who's using it, and make sure we cover the base use cases as
>> well as inviting people in for however they may have extended it. I'll
>> send an email to that effect now.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Charley Baker
>> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 1:16 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > As a sidenote, deprecating CookieManager can be a totally independent
>> thing
>> > since currently nothing loads it automatically in Watir. So if someone
>> is
>> > using it then they had to load it manually. I'd say that makes it even
>> more
>> > doubtful that it's used. But who knows. Just don'd deprecate it before
>> > there's some real implementation :)
>> > Jarmo
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 10:11 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com
>> >
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> That sounds like a good general API. Watir has had the CookieManager
>> >> trailing around for a while as a contributed component. I'm not sure
>> >> how many people use it, but it's a bit weak and is more of an addon
>> >> than truly integrated into the core API which it should be. I've
>> >> hacked around that area a bit for some of the gap common domains, and
>> >> cookie refreshes.
>> >>
>> >> I'd like to get more feedback from users, as this is a fairly common
>> >> case. I'll ping a few people as well, since the Gap uses various
>> >> toplevel domains and redirection but some common cookies across
>> >> domains for a type of SSO. A lot of the cookie work there was visiting
>> >> custom urls for refreshing/deleting. FB had something similar.
>> >>
>> >> This is a good idea to incorporate cookie management more cleanly, and
>> >> the api looks good. Next steps imho, let's figure out who if anyone is
>> >> using the CookieManager, and deprecate that. Pull a few use cases from
>> >> some companies that are doing a lot cookie management, write some
>> >> tests and implement.
>> >>
>> >> Thoughts?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Charley Baker
>> >> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified
>> >> >> API
>> >> >> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API
>> like
>> >> >> this:
>> >> >> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
>> >> >> browser.clear # removes all cookies
>> >> >> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
>> >> >> browser.delete new_cookie
>> >> >> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood
>> >> >> correctly
>> >> >> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
>> >> >> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other
>> >> >> implementations
>> >> >> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe
>> >> >> just
>> >> >> "name".
>> >> >
>> >> > You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
>> >> > Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
>> >> >
>> >> > I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
>> >> > will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
>> >> > way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
>> >> > cookies look like this:
>> >> >
>> >> > {
>> >> >  :name => "foo",
>> >> >  :value => "bar",
>> >> >  :path => "/some/path",
>> >> >  :domain => "some.domain",
>> >> >  :expires => DateTime,
>> >> >  :secure  => true/false
>> >> > }
>> >> >
>> >> > When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
>> >> > :path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
>> >> > the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
>> >> > (valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).
>> >> >
>> >> > A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects
>> the
>> >> > current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it
>> will
>> >> > raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
>> >> > clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
>> >> > reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
>> >> > light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
>> >> > (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
>> >> > can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.
>> >> >
>> >> > Jari
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the
>> >> >> limitations
>> >> >> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object
>> >> >> already
>> >> >> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as
>> a
>> >> >> requirement.
>> >> >> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related
>> with
>> >> >> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And
>> nothing
>> >> >> for
>> >> >> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject
>> and
>> >> >> free
>> >> >> to change, i guess.
>> >> >> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
>> >> >> Jarmo
>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >> >>
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >> >
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Wtr-development mailing list
>> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 17:34:14 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 15:34:14 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinf8xDtv=j1m4LFSS2pQyppmyMZap=W2tb6qFXO@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikf0qqmffUpeapEnph1fC_3GeMn8zuomFgEoaEB@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim1=FY4GiqtoRsnN=vBtNn6SapGkbs5LDs26tLa@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin1NLyw=EXUBdDFQusLeBPoZQZKWnwRrLOLpMzD@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinf8xDtv=j1m4LFSS2pQyppmyMZap=W2tb6qFXO@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinbcuDTP1VQ_RS3HGHzc3fokQDXua6OXfJ5UCXU@mail.gmail.com>

Remove it eventually and have warnings in place until then. It doesn't
belong in the main Watir libs, since it's really not supported by unit
tests or anyone using it. There's a lot of clean up that needs to
happen, it's just a careful matter of staging it all, not breaking
backward compatibility and even then having a script and/or blogs on
the upgrade process. While watir-webdriver may be the future of watir
for some branch, we have to be careful about the thousands of users we
have for the current version.




Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:12 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:
> By deprecate do you mean
>
> ?(a) remove it; or
> ?(b) cause to issue a deprecation warning when required?
>
> Bret
>
> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 3:39 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Yep, of course. My only thought there was to deprecate it, since it is
>> a bit old and untested, as well as ping the watir general list and
>> find out who's using it, and make sure we cover the base use cases as
>> well as inviting people in for however they may have extended it. I'll
>> send an email to that effect now.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Charley Baker
>> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 1:16 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > As a sidenote, deprecating CookieManager can be a totally independent
>> > thing
>> > since currently nothing loads it automatically in Watir. So if someone
>> > is
>> > using it then they had to load it manually. I'd say that makes it even
>> > more
>> > doubtful that it's used. But who knows. Just don'd deprecate it before
>> > there's some real implementation :)
>> > Jarmo
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 10:11 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> That sounds like a good general API. Watir has had the CookieManager
>> >> trailing around for a while as a contributed component. I'm not sure
>> >> how many people use it, but it's a bit weak and is more of an addon
>> >> than truly integrated into the core API which it should be. I've
>> >> hacked around that area a bit for some of the gap common domains, and
>> >> cookie refreshes.
>> >>
>> >> I'd like to get more feedback from users, as this is a fairly common
>> >> case. I'll ping a few people as well, since the Gap uses various
>> >> toplevel domains and redirection but some common cookies across
>> >> domains for a type of SSO. A lot of the cookie work there was visiting
>> >> custom urls for refreshing/deleting. FB had something similar.
>> >>
>> >> This is a good idea to incorporate cookie management more cleanly, and
>> >> the api looks good. Next steps imho, let's figure out who if anyone is
>> >> using the CookieManager, and deprecate that. Pull a few use cases from
>> >> some companies that are doing a lot cookie management, write some
>> >> tests and implement.
>> >>
>> >> Thoughts?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Charley Baker
>> >> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:58 AM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> > On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >> In #watir channel we had a short discussion about a possible unified
>> >> >> API
>> >> >> between all current Watir implementations. We came up with an API
>> >> >> like
>> >> >> this:
>> >> >> browser.cookies # returns Cookies object which includes Enumerable
>> >> >> browser.clear # removes all cookies
>> >> >> browser << new_cookie # adds cookie
>> >> >> browser.delete new_cookie
>> >> >> #<< should take a Cookie object as an argument if i understood
>> >> >> correctly
>> >> >> with #delete cookies are deleted only by "name" when talking about
>> >> >> Watir-WebDriver, but maybe it's/will be different with other
>> >> >> implementations
>> >> >> so #delete should also take a Cookie object as an argument. Or maybe
>> >> >> just
>> >> >> "name".
>> >> >
>> >> > You probably mean browser.cookies.clear, browser.cookies << etc.
>> >> > Something like this: https://gist.github.com/763769.
>> >> >
>> >> > I think #add wouldn't need to take a separate Cookie object - a Hash
>> >> > will probably do fine (the Cookies class can do some validation). The
>> >> > way it works in WebDriver (which IMO it would make sense to adopt),
>> >> > cookies look like this:
>> >> >
>> >> > {
>> >> > ?:name => "foo",
>> >> > ?:value => "bar",
>> >> > ?:path => "/some/path",
>> >> > ?:domain => "some.domain",
>> >> > ?:expires => DateTime,
>> >> > ?:secure ?=> true/false
>> >> > }
>> >> >
>> >> > When adding a Cookie, only the :name and :value keys are mandatory,
>> >> > :path defaults to "/", :secure defaults to false, :domain defaults to
>> >> > the current domain, and :expires will only be set if set by the user
>> >> > (valid types are Time, DateTime, or Numeric (number of seconds)).
>> >> >
>> >> > A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects
>> >> > the
>> >> > current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it
>> >> > will
>> >> > raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
>> >> > clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
>> >> > reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
>> >> > light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
>> >> > (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
>> >> > can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.
>> >> >
>> >> > Jari
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >> Jari liked more the API where "name" is the argument due to the
>> >> >> limitations
>> >> >> of WebDriver, but this would mean that if user has a Cookie object
>> >> >> already
>> >> >> then he/she had to execute #name explicitly. I wouldn't make that as
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> requirement.
>> >> >> I also noticed that currently Watir doesn't have anything related
>> >> >> with
>> >> >> cookies except CookieManager, which seems not to be best. And
>> >> >> nothing
>> >> >> for
>> >> >> FireWatir. That means that the API for cookies is an open subject
>> >> >> and
>> >> >> free
>> >> >> to change, i guess.
>> >> >> What are other's thoughts about the matter?
>> >> >> Jarmo
>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >> >>
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >> >
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Wtr-development mailing list
>> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From simon.m.stewart at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 17:44:17 2011
From: simon.m.stewart at gmail.com (Simon Stewart)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 22:44:17 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=0c1u8OOpwjb_oo4bxpP8C_5WT2VpKDdth0Wce@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 6:58 PM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:

> A constraint in WebDriver is that cookie manipulation only affects the
> current domain - if Cookies#add is called with another domain, it will
> raise an InvalidCookieDomain error. Likewise, Cookies#clear will only
> clear cookies for the current domain. I'm not entirely sure what the
> reason for this is (I'm suspecting IE), perhaps Simon can shed some
> light. If we want cross-browser compatible, we may need to
> (artificially) impose this constraint , even for implementations that
> can support cross-domain cookie manipulation.

The constraint is laid down because we sometimes need to implement the
cookie code in pure JS. At that point, the only cookies available are
those that are visible in the current domain. The WebDriver API
mirrors this constraint. It does mean that in those browsers where we
have better integration with the browser the API is more constrained
than it needs to be, but it also means that we have a consistent
contract between browsers.

FWIW, I believe that the SafariWatir is probably the most limited
watir implementation when dealing with cookies because of its use of
JS, so I'd be looking to use that as the "lowest common denominator".
Also, no-one's really got a good way of acknowledging HTTP only
cookies.

Simon

From jari.bakken at gmail.com  Mon Jan  3 18:36:26 2011
From: jari.bakken at gmail.com (Jari Bakken)
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 00:36:26 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=0c1u8OOpwjb_oo4bxpP8C_5WT2VpKDdth0Wce@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=0c1u8OOpwjb_oo4bxpP8C_5WT2VpKDdth0Wce@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6360055127416202848@unknownmsgid>

Den 3. jan. 2011 kl. 23:55 skrev Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com>:

>
> The constraint is laid down because we sometimes need to implement the
> cookie code in pure JS.
> At that point, the only cookies available are
> those that are visible in the current domain. The WebDriver API
> mirrors this constraint. It does mean that in those browsers where we
> have better integration with the browser the API is more constrained
> than it needs to be, but it also means that we have a consistent
> contract between browsers.

For future reference, where is that?

>
> Also, no-one's really got a good way of acknowledging HTTP only
> cookies.

I'm not sure what that means. What are HTTP only cookies?

>
> Simon
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development

From bret at pettichord.com  Mon Jan  3 21:52:58 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Mon, 3 Jan 2011 20:52:58 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Leadership Changes on the Watir Project
Message-ID: <AANLkTim9hNDwMDcpKvXxJEnACoiQFwwT_hs5kYys66sA@mail.gmail.com>

Charley Baker and I have decided on some changes in how we will be leading
the Watir project. For many years, we have shared this responsibility and
have shared the "Lead Developer" title. At my request, Charley has agreed to
take over as Lead Developer. As such he will be responsible for the
day-to-day technical decisions and managing the various contributions. He
has actually already taken on most of the responsibility so this is really a
reflection of reality.

As Lead Developer, he will make sure we are responding appropriately to Jira
tickets <http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR> and Github pull
requests<https://github.com/bret/watir/pulls>.
As the project has had more users, more releases and more contributors these
responsibilities have only grown. I know that Charley will welcome help with
this. If you have the time to review new Jira tickets or pull requests, we
would love it if you would comment with your opinions or observations.

I plan to continue to contribute as a developer to the project. For example,
I need to finish my work on adding the option to use
zero-indexing<https://github.com/bret/watir/tree/zero-index>
.

This change will also allow me to continue to comment on contributions but
without my comments being interpreted as final. For example, I might
complain that a contribution lacks unit tests, but Charley may decide (as I
have decided before) that this is a risk that we can afford to take in a
particular case. Indeed, my hope is to write more about the principles that
have defined Watir.

But mostly, I am handing over the lead developer responsibilities to Charley
so that I can focus on fund-raising.

I want to get non-profit status for the Watir project, lead fund-raising
campaigns and use Convio software to collect donations. This will be a new
role for me, but one which I expect to get a lot of help with from my
colleagues at Convio, many of whom are experts in this kind of thing.

I will say more about that in a later post. By taking on the lead developer
responsibilities, Charley is giving me a chance to lead the Watir project in
this new way.
I have also posted this announcement on Watir.com.
http://watir.com/2011/01/04/leadership-changes-on-the-watir-project/

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Tue Jan  4 03:56:32 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 09:56:32 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Leadership Changes on the Watir Project
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim9hNDwMDcpKvXxJEnACoiQFwwT_hs5kYys66sA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTim9hNDwMDcpKvXxJEnACoiQFwwT_hs5kYys66sA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=35_6wQFdx_=Qek=1jEd1anh5BJzhdeZQn+xEP@mail.gmail.com>

Great news Bret. I am glad to see you more involved in Watir again, and also
blogging again.

?eljko
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From simon.m.stewart at gmail.com  Tue Jan  4 05:57:51 2011
From: simon.m.stewart at gmail.com (Simon Stewart)
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 10:57:51 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] proposal for cookies API
In-Reply-To: <6360055127416202848@unknownmsgid>
References: <AANLkTik2MQQ1W6-7VaSf2YXZ+c-Yr3M_uP7H0yCxbM9P@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik4c4kPsdDZu56Epw8a94cOr+Od+h9irpMpgNA_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=0c1u8OOpwjb_oo4bxpP8C_5WT2VpKDdth0Wce@mail.gmail.com>
	<6360055127416202848@unknownmsgid>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinmB2Qe-YRG2XBwxcPg-u3ba738wdMLBZ-mL1pQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 11:36 PM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:
> Den 3. jan. 2011 kl. 23:55 skrev Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com>:
>
>>
>> The constraint is laid down because we sometimes need to implement the
>> cookie code in pure JS.
>> At that point, the only cookies available are
>> those that are visible in the current domain. The WebDriver API
>> mirrors this constraint. It does mean that in those browsers where we
>> have better integration with the browser the API is more constrained
>> than it needs to be, but it also means that we have a consistent
>> contract between browsers.
>
> For future reference, where is that?

Strictly speaking: that we only return cookies that would be visible
using Javascript from the current frame that is selected. The tests
are located at:

http://code.google.com/p/selenium/source/browse/trunk/common/test/java/org/openqa/selenium/CookieImplementationTest.java

>> Also, no-one's really got a good way of acknowledging HTTP only
>> cookies.
>
> I'm not sure what that means. What are HTTP only cookies?

Terrifying. They're cookies that are _not_ viewable from client-side
scripts. I've not seen them much in the wild yet (no pun intended)

http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-httpstate-cookie-09
http://www.owasp.org/index.php/HttpOnly

Simon

From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Tue Jan  4 15:41:38 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2011 22:41:38 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Leadership Changes on the Watir Project
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=35_6wQFdx_=Qek=1jEd1anh5BJzhdeZQn+xEP@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTim9hNDwMDcpKvXxJEnACoiQFwwT_hs5kYys66sA@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=35_6wQFdx_=Qek=1jEd1anh5BJzhdeZQn+xEP@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTim5+tg5VrU8f2Uis-MGkzU_dgJJJsYWGrpmEGTi@mail.gmail.com>

Good luck on that new journey!

Jarmo

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 10:56 AM, ?eljko Filipin <
zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:

> Great news Bret. I am glad to see you more involved in Watir again, and
> also blogging again.
>
> ?eljko
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Wed Jan  5 14:45:59 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 13:45:59 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this Friday
 at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
Message-ID: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jari.bakken at gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 14:52:10 2011
From: jari.bakken at gmail.com (Jari Bakken)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 20:52:10 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=JmUaovAa3==xNoWgMC99DzgK=WEX5gte0d3q_@mail.gmail.com>

Nice initiative! See you there.

From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 15:06:42 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 22:06:42 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>

Nice. What are the topics?

I'm afraid i cannot participate at this, but i'm probably logged into the
IRC so i can read the backlog.

Jarmo

On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:

>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 15:35:27 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 13:35:27 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=JmUaovAa3==xNoWgMC99DzgK=WEX5gte0d3q_@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=JmUaovAa3==xNoWgMC99DzgK=WEX5gte0d3q_@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin+7mscauwMeyppCabDrRFT+nZuz9HnvnbOOuiO@mail.gmail.com>

I'll be there as well. It's long overdue to have some standing standups. :)

Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 12:52 PM, Jari Bakken <jari.bakken at gmail.com> wrote:
> Nice initiative! See you there.
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From bpettichord at gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 14:47:59 2011
From: bpettichord at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2011 19:47:59 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Fri Jan 7 9am -
	9:30am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
Message-ID: <0015175d671889ffca04991ea9c2@google.com>

You have been invited to the following event.

Title: Watir Dev Standup
When: Fri Jan 7 9am ? 9:30am Central Time
Where: IRC #watir channel
Calendar: wtr-development at rubyforge.org
Who:
     * Bret Pettichord - organizer
     * wtr-development at rubyforge.org

Event details:  
https://www.google.com/calendar/event?action=VIEW&eid=b21qdDZvNjQ5cjN1cm81aTNtbDlvdm1wY2Mgd3RyLWRldmVsb3BtZW50QHJ1Ynlmb3JnZS5vcmc&tok=MjEjYnBldHRpY2hvcmRAZ21haWwuY29tMzBhMWRhMDc0NTdmM2M4YjcyNDY4NDkxNDFiY2NiNmQ2MDU4MzVjYQ&ctz=America%2FChicago&hl=en

Invitation from Google Calendar: https://www.google.com/calendar/

You are receiving this courtesy email at the account  
wtr-development at rubyforge.org because you are an attendee of this event.

To stop receiving future notifications for this event, decline this event.  
Alternatively you can sign up for a Google account at  
https://www.google.com/calendar/ and control your notification settings for  
your entire calendar.
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 15:59:42 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 22:59:42 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Release?
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=UK_xCxACz15O=4F4wcUgc3BaP2ujiv8KY5ZVY@mail.gmail.com>

Hi!

Is there any objections against making the 1.7.0 release now?

It has been in pre for quite some time now and i've fixed some of the bugs
also. I'd be willing to make a final release. I'd hoped for better feedback
though.

Jarmo
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Wed Jan  5 17:41:21 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 15:41:21 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] Release?
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=UK_xCxACz15O=4F4wcUgc3BaP2ujiv8KY5ZVY@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=UK_xCxACz15O=4F4wcUgc3BaP2ujiv8KY5ZVY@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin_U_Smgd5nsBs5N=hi+7OY+fMAJ4+y8UTRiptT@mail.gmail.com>

I was hoping for more response as well. Push it and we'll see what
happens. Next step would be to jump on the jira requests which I
should be able to do.

-c


On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:59 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi!
> Is there any objections against making the 1.7.0 release now?
> It has been in pre for quite some time now and i've fixed some of the bugs
> also. I'd be willing to make a final release. I'd hoped for better feedback
> though.
> Jarmo
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From bret at pettichord.com  Wed Jan  5 17:52:05 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2011 16:52:05 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>

There are three questions

1. What have you been doing lately for the Watir project?
2. What are you planning to do in the next week?
3. What issues are blocking you?

We'll give everyone a chance to answer these three questions. In the process
we will probably find that we will need further discussion on particular
topics. We can have those discussions after we've gone around the circle, or
perhaps at another time to be scheduled during the meeting.

Bret

On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Nice. What are the topics?
>
> I'm afraid i cannot participate at this, but i'm probably logged into the
> IRC so i can read the backlog.
>
> Jarmo
>
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 03:56:45 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 10:56:45 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir 1.7.0 Released
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=ZEM1GvqoNy39g_Rz=9CioiJbjhkF7YYUX=fdE@mail.gmail.com>

Hello and Happy New Year to everyone!

This year's first Watir is here - version 1.7.0!

Install it with:

Windows:
  gem install watir

Linux/OS X:
  gem install firewatir

Changelog:

=== IE improvements

* Fixed Watir::IE#close_all to close all IE windows, even the ones with
tabs. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-463 (Jarmo Pertman)
* IE#wait waits now again until browser has a state of READYSTATE_COMPLETE
due to strange timing issues. Closes
http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-466(Jarmo Pertman)
* Added CSS3 selectors with usage like browser.text_field(:css =>
"input[name='text1']") (Jonas Tingeborn)
* Updated bundled version of AutoIt to 3.3.6.1. Closes
http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-440 (Jarmo Pertman)

=== Firefox improvements

* Fixed Element#exists? for cases where nested elements were used for
locating (Alok Menghrajani)
* Ignore uppercase tags in XHTML when searching for elements (Alok
Menghrajani)

=== General improvements

* Return Element#id correctly when using Element#when_present and friends
methods. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-469 (Jarmo Pertman)

Whole Changelog is available at
http://github.com/bret/watir/compare/v1.6.7...v1.7.0

Watir Development Team
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 03:59:47 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 10:59:47 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Release?
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin_U_Smgd5nsBs5N=hi+7OY+fMAJ4+y8UTRiptT@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=UK_xCxACz15O=4F4wcUgc3BaP2ujiv8KY5ZVY@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin_U_Smgd5nsBs5N=hi+7OY+fMAJ4+y8UTRiptT@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinrpv1utbhiB0C=Dto-BZHxgMPOd-0Kd_TZpQQT@mail.gmail.com>

Just released and sent out an announcement about it. I guess the lack of
feedback is related with the fact that we're releasin more often than before
:P There's automatically less excitement involved, hehe.

Jarmo

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:41 AM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:

> I was hoping for more response as well. Push it and we'll see what
> happens. Next step would be to jump on the jira requests which I
> should be able to do.
>
> -c
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 1:59 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi!
> > Is there any objections against making the 1.7.0 release now?
> > It has been in pre for quite some time now and i've fixed some of the
> bugs
> > also. I'd be willing to make a final release. I'd hoped for better
> feedback
> > though.
> > Jarmo
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From abaird at bairdsnet.net  Thu Jan  6 08:53:10 2011
From: abaird at bairdsnet.net (Alan Baird)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 07:53:10 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Release?
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinrpv1utbhiB0C=Dto-BZHxgMPOd-0Kd_TZpQQT@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=UK_xCxACz15O=4F4wcUgc3BaP2ujiv8KY5ZVY@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin_U_Smgd5nsBs5N=hi+7OY+fMAJ4+y8UTRiptT@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinrpv1utbhiB0C=Dto-BZHxgMPOd-0Kd_TZpQQT@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=N+KNnWtyvEcSeJuQq_Cu7HUcLjxz=jWk8SzK6@mail.gmail.com>

Jarmo/Charley -

I meant to send this earlier but I had a flood in my house.  Needless
to say, I've been busy.  :)

I've been running 1.7 rc1 at work and I think we are ok.  I did find
an unrelated bug with Watir::IE::Process in conjunction with IE8 (I
think).  I will open a ticket shortly.  I have not had a chance to run
the unit tests.

Alan

From jadhav.prajakta at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 04:22:21 2011
From: jadhav.prajakta at gmail.com (Prajakta Jadhav)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 14:52:21 +0530
Subject: [Wtr-development] [wtr-general] Watir 1.7.0 Released
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=ZEM1GvqoNy39g_Rz=9CioiJbjhkF7YYUX=fdE@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=ZEM1GvqoNy39g_Rz=9CioiJbjhkF7YYUX=fdE@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinm_1=CqEbOPcZwkeD00Z1Y+fcT5=zfCuR5GFf4@mail.gmail.com>

Happy New Year to you too!
And thanks for the new Watir. :)

Is this Watir version tested on latest Ruby, i.e 1.9.2 or is Ruby 1.8.6
still the recommended ruby version for Watir?

Regards,
Prajakta



On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello and Happy New Year to everyone!
>
> This year's first Watir is here - version 1.7.0!
>
> Install it with:
>
> Windows:
>   gem install watir
>
> Linux/OS X:
>   gem install firewatir
>
> Changelog:
>
> === IE improvements
>
> * Fixed Watir::IE#close_all to close all IE windows, even the ones with
> tabs. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-463 (Jarmo Pertman)
> * IE#wait waits now again until browser has a state of READYSTATE_COMPLETE
> due to strange timing issues. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-466(Jarmo Pertman)
> * Added CSS3 selectors with usage like browser.text_field(:css =>
> "input[name='text1']") (Jonas Tingeborn)
> * Updated bundled version of AutoIt to 3.3.6.1. Closes
> http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-440 (Jarmo Pertman)
>
> === Firefox improvements
>
> * Fixed Element#exists? for cases where nested elements were used for
> locating (Alok Menghrajani)
> * Ignore uppercase tags in XHTML when searching for elements (Alok
> Menghrajani)
>
> === General improvements
>
> * Return Element#id correctly when using Element#when_present and friends
> methods. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-469 (Jarmo Pertman)
>
> Whole Changelog is available at
> http://github.com/bret/watir/compare/v1.6.7...v1.7.0
>
> Watir Development Team
>
> --
> Before posting, please read http://watir.com/support. In short: search
> before you ask, be nice.
>
> watir-general at googlegroups.com
> http://groups.google.com/group/watir-general
> watir-general+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com<watir-general%2Bunsubscribe at googlegroups.com>
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 09:05:32 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 16:05:32 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] [wtr-general] Watir 1.7.0 Released
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinm_1=CqEbOPcZwkeD00Z1Y+fcT5=zfCuR5GFf4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=ZEM1GvqoNy39g_Rz=9CioiJbjhkF7YYUX=fdE@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinm_1=CqEbOPcZwkeD00Z1Y+fcT5=zfCuR5GFf4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTincpQseErxGhSr6+PMQONO1U3jsxiJCLa-GxJ9Q@mail.gmail.com>

1.8.6 or 1.8.7 are still recommended due to it's dependencies.

Jarmo

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 11:22 AM, Prajakta Jadhav
<jadhav.prajakta at gmail.com>wrote:

> Happy New Year to you too!
> And thanks for the new Watir. :)
>
> Is this Watir version tested on latest Ruby, i.e 1.9.2 or is Ruby 1.8.6
> still the recommended ruby version for Watir?
>
> Regards,
> Prajakta
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello and Happy New Year to everyone!
>>
>> This year's first Watir is here - version 1.7.0!
>>
>> Install it with:
>>
>> Windows:
>>   gem install watir
>>
>> Linux/OS X:
>>   gem install firewatir
>>
>> Changelog:
>>
>> === IE improvements
>>
>> * Fixed Watir::IE#close_all to close all IE windows, even the ones with
>> tabs. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-463 (Jarmo Pertman)
>> * IE#wait waits now again until browser has a state of READYSTATE_COMPLETE
>> due to strange timing issues. Closes
>> http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-466 (Jarmo Pertman)
>> * Added CSS3 selectors with usage like browser.text_field(:css =>
>> "input[name='text1']") (Jonas Tingeborn)
>> * Updated bundled version of AutoIt to 3.3.6.1. Closes
>> http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-440 (Jarmo Pertman)
>>
>> === Firefox improvements
>>
>> * Fixed Element#exists? for cases where nested elements were used for
>> locating (Alok Menghrajani)
>> * Ignore uppercase tags in XHTML when searching for elements (Alok
>> Menghrajani)
>>
>> === General improvements
>>
>> * Return Element#id correctly when using Element#when_present and friends
>> methods. Closes http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-469 (Jarmo Pertman)
>>
>> Whole Changelog is available at
>> http://github.com/bret/watir/compare/v1.6.7...v1.7.0
>>
>> Watir Development Team
>>
>> --
>> Before posting, please read http://watir.com/support. In short: search
>> before you ask, be nice.
>>
>> watir-general at googlegroups.com
>> http://groups.google.com/group/watir-general
>> watir-general+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com<watir-general%2Bunsubscribe at googlegroups.com>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From watirjira at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 09:26:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Alan Baird (JIRA))
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 08:26:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Created: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
Message-ID: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>

Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
------------------------------------------------------------

                 Key: WTR-472
                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
             Project: Watir
          Issue Type: Bug
          Components: Other
    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
            Reporter: Alan Baird
            Priority: Major


I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
{code}
c:\>pik switch 1.8.7

c:\>ruby -v
ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]

c:\>gem list watir

*** LOCAL GEMS ***

watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)

c:\>irb --noreadline
irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
=> true
irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
        from (irb):2
irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
        from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
        from (irb):3
{code}

I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.


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From watirjira at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 09:47:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Alan Baird (JIRA))
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 08:47:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <1315701.1009.1294325240447.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20078#action_20078 ] 

Alan Baird commented on WTR-472:
--------------------------------

I guess I spoke too soon, it seems that this affects 1.8.6 as well:
{code}
c:\>pik switch 1.8.6
Select which Ruby you want:
1. 186: ruby 1.8.6 (2007-09-24 patchlevel 111) [i386-mswin32]
2. 186: ruby 1.8.6 (2010-02-04 patchlevel 398) [i386-mingw32]
?  1

c:\>irb --noreadline
irb(main):001:0> RUBY_VERSION
=> "1.8.6"
irb(main):002:0> require 'watir'
=> true
irb(main):003:0> br1 = Watir::IE.new_process
NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for []:Array
        from C:/ruby/186-p026/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
        from C:/ruby/186-p026/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
        from C:/ruby/186-p026/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
        from C:/ruby/186-p026/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
        from (irb):3
irb(main):004:0> Watir::VERSION
=> "1.7.0"
irb(main):005:0>
{code}

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From watirjira at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 10:43:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Jarmo Pertman (JIRA))
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 09:43:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <29621766.1013.1294328600828.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20080#action_20080 ] 

Jarmo Pertman commented on WTR-472:
-----------------------------------

Forgot to ask, why are you even using these not-so-standard methods? Why just not use Watir::Browser.new (preferred) or Watir::IE.new?

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From watirjira at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 10:43:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Jarmo Pertman (JIRA))
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 09:43:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <11937038.1011.1294328600695.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20079#action_20079 ] 

Jarmo Pertman commented on WTR-472:
-----------------------------------

It seems that the following code in ie-process.rb:
{noformat}
     def window
        Wait.until do
          IE.each do | ie |
            window = ie.ie
            hwnd = ie.hwnd
            process_id = Process.process_id_from_hwnd hwnd        
            return window if process_id == @process_id
          end
        end
      end
{noformat}

Doesn't find the window - e.g. there's no process_id which is same as @process_id. And in Ruby all methods return last statement's value if no explicit "return" keywords are used. In this case the result will be Array of all IE windows from IE.each.

The reason why the correct window is not found is related with some other bugs where in ie-class.rb method "each" doesn't find the window:
{noformat}
shell = WIN32OLE.new('Shell.Application')
shell.Windows.each {|window| p window.path }
{noformat}

The following code above doesn't find all IE windows on win7 for example. I guess the solution would not to use Shell.Application to find for all windows.

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 10:57:56 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 17:57:56 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin2v6QZnc_KvvVm7PSZoaAV0S+8E0XiUAH8suG1@mail.gmail.com>

Since i cannot probably take part of it then i'm gonna answer right here
right now shortly.

1. Just released new version!

2. I'm not sure about that time constraint. I wouldn't set up such a time
constraints. At least not for myself. I have already enough time-constraints
in my personal and work life and don't see that any additional ones would
help. I'd restate the question as "What are you planning to do next?" :)
Anyway, i can see four main things which we could do regarding Watir:
  - remove ActiveSupport dependency from FireWatir (Charley has been doing
that for some time now - ask him the 3rd question)

  - remove dependencies for win32/api and AutoIt - here my RAutomation [1]
lib could help... i guess i just have to start integrating it into Watir...
since this will be a big change then it has to be tested more.. any ideas
how to do that? Anyone wants to test it with me straight from the GitHub
master while i'm moving forward step by step?

   - add support for Ruby 1.9.x - maybe the previous step will do that fine
since we have seen some people recompiling win32/api gem for 1.9.2 and it
has been working - so if the dependency for win32/api is removed then there
should be support for 1.9.2 too (RAutomation has tested on 1.8.6, 1.8.7,
1.9.1, 1.9.2 MRI and JRuby 1.5.x).

   - bugs in jira should be taken one by one starting from the oldest and
see if they're still relevant by actually digging into the code and then
fix/close them or write some additional information to the jira comments
section

3. personal life and other interesting personal projects, so i'd say general
time constraints. Whenever i feel it and have time for it, then i'm looking
towards improving something in Watir.

[1] https://github.com/jarmo/rautomation<http://github.com/jarmo/rautomation>

<http://github.com/jarmo/rautomation>Jarmo

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:52 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> There are three questions
>
> 1. What have you been doing lately for the Watir project?
> 2. What are you planning to do in the next week?
> 3. What issues are blocking you?
>
> We'll give everyone a chance to answer these three questions. In the
> process we will probably find that we will need further discussion on
> particular topics. We can have those discussions after we've gone around the
> circle, or perhaps at another time to be scheduled during the meeting.
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Nice. What are the topics?
>>
>> I'm afraid i cannot participate at this, but i'm probably logged into the
>> IRC so i can read the backlog.
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>>  On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bret Pettichord
>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>
>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From watirjira at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 12:06:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Alan Baird (JIRA))
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 11:06:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <28856984.1016.1294333580567.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20081#action_20081 ] 

Alan Baird commented on WTR-472:
--------------------------------

Actually, I was going to open a ticket on that issue as well but this one prevented me from investigating it.  The problem is that IE8 opens 2 processes for the first window and another process for each subsequent open.  Unfortunately, the process id that is returned when Process.create is called (this is the Process from win32-process) doesn't consistently return the right process id when more than one window is opened.  I don't fully understand all of the reasons for this, but it's definitely the cause.

I'm not sure why Watir::IE.new would be non-standard.  I never considered switching since I didn't need multi-browser support and didn't feel the need to change my scripts.  The reason I'm using .new_process instead of new is that this has been the recommended way of opening the browser in several watir-general emails where browser performance has been discussed.  I had some performance problems with Watir::IE.new and it was resolved by switching to .new_process.

I've been using Watir::IE.new this morning and that gets me around the problem, but I think this could also affect .click_no_wait as I've been having issues with it as well.  Ultimately, this code should fail gracefully if it can't find the window it's looking for.

I'll try to do some more investigation on this later.

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From watirjira at gmail.com  Thu Jan  6 12:53:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Jarmo Pertman (JIRA))
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 11:53:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <19700579.1018.1294336400454.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20082#action_20082 ] 

Jarmo Pertman commented on WTR-472:
-----------------------------------

I'm not aware of these performance issues when using #new, but that doesn't mean that they're not existing of course. I also didn't state that #new is non-standard.

What problems with #click_no_wait? You mean that Watir doesn't find the window on which to perform the #click_no_wait?

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From watirjira at gmail.com  Fri Jan  7 09:31:22 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Alan Baird (JIRA))
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 08:31:22 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <4889082.1025.1294410682242.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20083#action_20083 ] 

Alan Baird commented on WTR-472:
--------------------------------

Jarmo/Charley -

After a quick search, here is one example of the emails that have been circulating on watir-general from Bret:

"If you want to close and reopen IE, I suggest you use IE.new_process
instead of IE.new. This is more reliable and will ensure that the
process terminates."

- from the [wtr-general] IE out of memory error (buffer overflow) thread on 4/6/09

As for the problems with click_no_wait, I owe you some more explicit information, hopefully I will turn that into another ticket.  You will have to forgive me for the spottiness of some of the info.  We got forcefully converted to a Win7/IE8 environment recently at work and I'm having to deal with a bunch of new issues all at the same time.  Sorting them out has been a real bear.  But, one of the issues I'm running into is that click_no_wait fails to click on a link/button that opens a popup.  My theory is that the new process that is spawned when click_no_wait executes can't find the new window.  I think there are some other variables that are affecting this, like if there is another window open and whether or not it was opened with administrative privileges.  

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From watirjira at gmail.com  Fri Jan  7 10:04:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord (JIRA))
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 09:04:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <31761403.1027.1294412660558.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20084#action_20084 ] 

Bret Pettichord commented on WTR-472:
-------------------------------------

IE.new_process actually makes IE work more like it does when you start it manually (which creates a new process) than when using IE.new (which does not). I would not consider it a non-standard method. Indeed, I've considered making this the default implementation of IE#new because it is often superior.

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

-- 
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From bret at pettichord.com  Fri Jan  7 11:00:59 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 10:00:59 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin2v6QZnc_KvvVm7PSZoaAV0S+8E0XiUAH8suG1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin2v6QZnc_KvvVm7PSZoaAV0S+8E0XiUAH8suG1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimWvEn=hiZ4OojQg0nbN_ufCBj++BhHWWs3ctjW@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for this Jarmo.

We'd like to have a standup meeting again next week. Would the same time
work for you then? If not, can you suggest an alternate time? We missed you!

Bret

On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 9:57 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Since i cannot probably take part of it then i'm gonna answer right here
> right now shortly.
>
> 1. Just released new version!
>
> 2. I'm not sure about that time constraint. I wouldn't set up such a time
> constraints. At least not for myself. I have already enough time-constraints
> in my personal and work life and don't see that any additional ones would
> help. I'd restate the question as "What are you planning to do next?" :)
> Anyway, i can see four main things which we could do regarding Watir:
>   - remove ActiveSupport dependency from FireWatir (Charley has been doing
> that for some time now - ask him the 3rd question)
>
>   - remove dependencies for win32/api and AutoIt - here my RAutomation [1]
> lib could help... i guess i just have to start integrating it into Watir...
> since this will be a big change then it has to be tested more.. any ideas
> how to do that? Anyone wants to test it with me straight from the GitHub
> master while i'm moving forward step by step?
>
>    - add support for Ruby 1.9.x - maybe the previous step will do that fine
> since we have seen some people recompiling win32/api gem for 1.9.2 and it
> has been working - so if the dependency for win32/api is removed then there
> should be support for 1.9.2 too (RAutomation has tested on 1.8.6, 1.8.7,
> 1.9.1, 1.9.2 MRI and JRuby 1.5.x).
>
>    - bugs in jira should be taken one by one starting from the oldest and
> see if they're still relevant by actually digging into the code and then
> fix/close them or write some additional information to the jira comments
> section
>
> 3. personal life and other interesting personal projects, so i'd say
> general time constraints. Whenever i feel it and have time for it, then i'm
> looking towards improving something in Watir.
>
> [1] https://github.com/jarmo/rautomation<http://github.com/jarmo/rautomation>
>
> <http://github.com/jarmo/rautomation>Jarmo
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 12:52 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> There are three questions
>>
>> 1. What have you been doing lately for the Watir project?
>> 2. What are you planning to do in the next week?
>> 3. What issues are blocking you?
>>
>> We'll give everyone a chance to answer these three questions. In the
>> process we will probably find that we will need further discussion on
>> particular topics. We can have those discussions after we've gone around the
>> circle, or perhaps at another time to be scheduled during the meeting.
>>
>> Bret
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Nice. What are the topics?
>>>
>>> I'm afraid i cannot participate at this, but i'm probably logged into the
>>> IRC so i can read the backlog.
>>>
>>> Jarmo
>>>
>>>  On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Bret Pettichord
>>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>>
>>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Fri Jan  7 12:03:27 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 18:03:27 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimWvEn=hiZ4OojQg0nbN_ufCBj++BhHWWs3ctjW@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin2v6QZnc_KvvVm7PSZoaAV0S+8E0XiUAH8suG1@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimWvEn=hiZ4OojQg0nbN_ufCBj++BhHWWs3ctjW@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimTpZZERoakc-NRyLL97Y5Eh6KC4j5nFrgVyenv@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry, I could not make it today, next week same time is fine with me.

Zeljko

From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  8 17:13:33 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 16:13:33 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Updating website with Opera information
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=8iCCMjzfaUT5mpDNFQbHY3Ph1upKmwSaZWUFS@mail.gmail.com>

I have just added Andreas to the Team page on our website.
http://watir.com/team/

It doesn't have a photo yet. Could someone put one up, perhaps from here:
https://github.com/andreastt

(This page, btw, is a pain to edit. DO NOT user the Wysiwyg editor for this:
it messes up the page.)

I am in the process of adding OperaWatir to the Platforms page as well.

Bret

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  8 17:30:41 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 16:30:41 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>

I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
recommend Ruby 1.8.6.

Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we update the
install instructions?

Bret

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  8 17:59:53 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 16:59:53 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Link to Watir News
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=zb_FYs6grFv=yZ79H+20Tq9jqDjTx2ZquTN8S@mail.gmail.com>

Alister, Zeljko,

I'm starting to make use of Watir.com's blog ability to post announcements
there about the watir project.

But there doesn't seem to be a public link to previous posts, except for the
link on the home page to the last three posts. Am I missing something?

Bret

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan  8 18:18:10 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 17:18:10 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Link to Watir News
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=zb_FYs6grFv=yZ79H+20Tq9jqDjTx2ZquTN8S@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=zb_FYs6grFv=yZ79H+20Tq9jqDjTx2ZquTN8S@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimfxD4J41gX1aasansbcno9cYPu_wbopHKrh=jG@mail.gmail.com>

I think what I want is a News item along the top of the home page.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 4:59 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:

> Alister, Zeljko,
>
> I'm starting to make use of Watir.com's blog ability to post announcements
> there about the watir project.
>
> But there doesn't seem to be a public link to previous posts, except for
> the link on the home page to the last three posts. Am I missing something?
>
> Bret
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>


-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Sat Jan  8 18:18:19 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 10:18:19 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>

I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the install
instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can cause
confusion straight away.

1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work computer
tomorrow ..

Cheers,
Tim


On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com> wrote:

> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
>
> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we update the
> install instructions?
>
> Bret
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From alister.scott at gmail.com  Sat Jan  8 23:13:39 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 15:13:39 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Link to Watir News
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimfxD4J41gX1aasansbcno9cYPu_wbopHKrh=jG@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=zb_FYs6grFv=yZ79H+20Tq9jqDjTx2ZquTN8S@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimfxD4J41gX1aasansbcno9cYPu_wbopHKrh=jG@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimBVqn074SFPkRRO44Wq3YCpJpnJCK_FkrBaREy@mail.gmail.com>

Sure is. I have added this, it should have been there.
http://watir.com/

We now have a menu structure for Watir.com which we can change to any way we
like, including external links.
You can modify this at: http://watir001.wordpress.com/wp-admin/nav-menus.php

Cheers,

Alister Scott
Brisbane, Australia
Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
Blog: http://watirmelon.com
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott

"There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more and
more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*


On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:18 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> I think what I want is a News item along the top of the home page.
>
> On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 4:59 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> Alister, Zeljko,
>>
>> I'm starting to make use of Watir.com's blog ability to post announcements
>> there about the watir project.
>>
>> But there doesn't seem to be a public link to previous posts, except for
>> the link on the home page to the last three posts. Am I missing something?
>>
>> Bret
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 06:01:32 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 13:01:32 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>

1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although there's
not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not mistaken.

Jarmo

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the install
> instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can cause
> confusion straight away.
>
> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work computer
> tomorrow ..
>
> Cheers,
> Tim
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
>> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
>>
>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we update
>> the install instructions?
>>
>> Bret
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From watirjira at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 07:25:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Jarmo Pertman (JIRA))
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 06:25:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <4006244.1038.1294575920633.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20086#action_20086 ] 

Jarmo Pertman commented on WTR-472:
-----------------------------------

To be honest i'm not sure why just now the problem started to appear. Only thing which has changed is IE.each due to the #close_all fix (http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-463). And IE.each is used for .new_process too which is now not finding all Windows. I don't understand how it found before and why it doesn't now... any ideas are welcome of course :)

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

-- 
This message is automatically generated by JIRA.
-
If you think it was sent incorrectly contact one of the administrators: http://jira.openqa.org/secure/Administrators.jspa
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From watirjira at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 09:50:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Jarmo Pertman (JIRA))
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 08:50:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <28155277.1041.1294584620488.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20087#action_20087 ] 

Jarmo Pertman commented on WTR-472:
-----------------------------------

Spent some more time investigating this issue.

I found out the reason why .start_process seemed to work before and not anymore. Before IE.each returned always nil and now it returns the array itself, because IE.each gathers all windows by using shell.Windows.each into a Ruby Array before yielding them (https://github.com/bret/watir/commit/ca7d0ec78ad80d44b57c11fa4ad72d2bc09d2e37). Check this out:

irb(main):013:0> shell.Windows.each {}
=> nil
irb(main):014:0> [].each {}
=> []

This means that Wait.until used in Process#window (ie-process.rb) didn't wait anymore for the process to start because an empty Array is as good as true in Ruby thus Wait.until just returned and thought that everyone is happy. I've fixed it in (https://github.com/bret/watir/commit/1dfdfc1428ea97e1d0a565731af98453a23b79d9) and .start_process is working again.

But why i mentioned that it "seemed to work" before? That's because it is only working if you don't have any IE windows opened with .start_process before. So if you do something like this:
{noformat}
Watir::IE.new # works
Watir::IE.start_process # works
Watir::IE.start_process # doesn't work, gets a timeout
{noformat}

On the other hand:
{noformat}
Watir::IE.new # works
browser = Watir::IE.start_process # works
browser.close # closes the browser opened by .start_process
Watir::IE.start_process # works
{noformat}

The reason is that Process.start in ie-process.rb uses win32/process .create method to create new processes and if there's no existing IE processes created by Process.create then everything works because the process_id returned by Process.create is valid. If you use Process.create 2 times in a row then the process_id is not valid anymore. That is happening because after Process.create is used then 2 processes are created with name iexplore.exe.

I'm not sure why this is happening but it seems to be Windows itself doing that. Anyway, the first process seems to be the "root" process and the second one the actual visible process. When using Process.create for the second time then also 2 processes will be created, but for some reason the first one will be killed and the second one will have that previous "root" as it's parent. And the process_id left for Watir is the one which got killed thus Watir won't find the process it's looking for and will get a timeout. Always.

You can reproduce it easily like this:
{noformat}
require "win32/process"
proc = Process.create(:app_name => "C:\\Program Files (x86)\\Internet Explorer\\iexplore.exe about:blank")
=> #<struct Struct::ProcessInfo process_handle=168, thread_handle=208, process_id=3560, thread_id=7152>
Process.kill 9, proc.process_id
=> [3560]
proc = Process.create(:app_name => "C:\\Program Files (x86)\\Internet Explorer\\iexplore.exe about:blank")
=> #<struct Struct::ProcessInfo process_handle=168, thread_handle=208, process_id=5588, thread_id=6040>
proc = Process.create(:app_name => "C:\\Program Files (x86)\\Internet Explorer\\iexplore.exe about:blank")
=> #<struct Struct::ProcessInfo process_handle=168, thread_handle=208, process_id=6580, thread_id=1144>
Process.kill 9, proc.process_id
Process::Error: The handle is invalid.
        from c:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/win32-process-0.6.5/lib/win32/process.rb:595:in `kill'
        from c:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/win32-process-0.6.5/lib/win32/process.rb:555:in `each'
        from c:/Ruby/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/win32-process-0.6.5/lib/win32/process.rb:555:in `kill'
        from (irb):17
        from ?:0
{noformat}

I also checked that the problems with IE.close_all (WTR-463) and using IE.start_process multiple times both exist in Watir 1.6.5.

This could mean that IE.close_all is almost never used at all and IE.start_process is not used multiple times in a row without closing previous IE window(s).

I tested all on Windows 7 64bit, but it seems to be quite similar on XP 32bit too.

I'm suggesting making a new release to "fix" IE.start_process ASAP to make it work like it was before.

Is there also any reason why window_tests are not included into core_tests? That's one of the reasons why the problem didn't come out before the release.

> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From watirjira at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 14:14:20 2011
From: watirjira at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord (JIRA))
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 13:14:20 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Wtr-development] [JIRA] Commented: (WTR-472) Issues with
 Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
In-Reply-To: <28313438.1006.1294323980557.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>
Message-ID: <24128406.1043.1294600460539.JavaMail.oqa-j2ee@openqa01.managed.contegix.com>


    [ http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=20088#action_20088 ] 

Bret Pettichord commented on WTR-472:
-------------------------------------

> This could mean that IE.close_all is almost never used at all and IE.start_process is not used multiple times in a row without closing previous IE window(s).

I wrote both of these methods and this assumption certainly corresponds to my own usage of these methods.

Thanks for the detailed analysis. I think you've figured it out. 

> Is there also any reason why window_tests are not included into core_tests? That's one of the reasons why the problem didn't come out before the release.

The reason is simply that the window_tests take over your desktop, so you can't do anything else while you are running the tests. Whereas the core_tests do not, so you can check email or whatever while you are running them.

Perhaps we need a standard checklist of tests we should run before a release so we don't miss something like this again? 

I agree that this warrants a 1.7.1 release ASAP.


> Issues with Watir::IE::Process.start_process and new_process
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>                 Key: WTR-472
>                 URL: http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472
>             Project: Watir
>          Issue Type: Bug
>          Components: Other
>    Affects Versions: 1.6.7
>         Environment: windows 7 IE 8
>            Reporter: Alan Baird
>            Priority: Major
>
> I noticed this on Ruby 1.8.7:
> {code}
> c:\>pik switch 1.8.7
> c:\>ruby -v
> ruby 1.8.7 (2010-08-16 patchlevel 302) [i386-mingw32]
> c:\>gem list watir
> *** LOCAL GEMS ***
> watir (1.7.0, 1.7.0.rc1, 1.6.7)
> c:\>irb --noreadline
> irb(main):001:0> require 'watir'
> => true
> irb(main):002:0> br = Watir::IE.new_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f6900 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from (irb):2
> irb(main):003:0> br = Watir::IE.start_process
> NoMethodError: undefined method `visible' for [#<Watir::IE:0x57f2850 url="about:blank" title="">]:Array
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:230:in `visible='
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:170:in `initialize_options'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:121:in `_new_process_init'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:113:in `new_process'
>         from C:/ruby/Ruby-187-p302/lib/ruby/gems/1.8/gems/watir-1.7.0/lib/watir/ie-class.rb:128:in `start_process'
>         from (irb):3
> {code}
> I'm not sure what is causing this.  I don't see this behavior with 1.8.6.

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From bret at pettichord.com  Sun Jan  9 14:17:02 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 13:17:02 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Link to Watir News
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimBVqn074SFPkRRO44Wq3YCpJpnJCK_FkrBaREy@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=zb_FYs6grFv=yZ79H+20Tq9jqDjTx2ZquTN8S@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimfxD4J41gX1aasansbcno9cYPu_wbopHKrh=jG@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimBVqn074SFPkRRO44Wq3YCpJpnJCK_FkrBaREy@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimXr-3d6HQO4T_jioJGE6y8YzfWdSOz_Pohkioc@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 10:13 PM, Alister Scott <alister.scott at gmail.com>wrote:

> Sure is. I have added this, it should have been there.
> http://watir.com/
>
> We now have a menu structure for Watir.com which we can change to any way
> we like, including external links.
> You can modify this at:
> http://watir001.wordpress.com/wp-admin/nav-menus.php
>
> Cheers,
>
> Alister Scott
> Brisbane, Australia
> Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
> Blog: http://watirmelon.com
> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott
>
> "There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more
> and more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:18 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> I think what I want is a News item along the top of the home page.
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 4:59 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Alister, Zeljko,
>>>
>>> I'm starting to make use of Watir.com's blog ability to post
>>> announcements there about the watir project.
>>>
>>> But there doesn't seem to be a public link to previous posts, except for
>>> the link on the home page to the last three posts. Am I missing something?
>>>
>>> Bret
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bret Pettichord
>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>
>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 15:55:37 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 07:55:37 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>

Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:

*= Installation*

*== Download and Install Ruby*
Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
  http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe

*== Check Version of RubyGems*
>From a command prompt confirm which version of rubygems are installed:
  C:\>gem -v
  1.3.7

Update rubygems if required:
  C:\>gem update
  Updating installed gems
  Nothing to update

*== [Optional] Installing Behind Authenticating Proxy*
If installing behind an authenticating proxy, first set the HTTP_PROXY
environment variable:
  set HTTP_PROXY=http://username:password at your.proxy.com:80

*== Installing Watir 1.7.0*
Install watir:
  C:\>gem install watir

[Optional] You can install watir without RDoc and RI (slightly quicker) as
follows:
  C:\>gem install watir --no-ri --no-rdoc

*== Quick Shakeout Using IRB*
  C:\>irb
  require 'rubygems'
  require 'watir'
  browser = Watir::Browser.new
  browser.goto("http://bit.ly/watir-example")



Cheers,
Tim


On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:01 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although
there's not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not mistaken.
> Jarmo
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the install
instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can cause
confusion straight away.
>>
>> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work computer
tomorrow ..
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Tim
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
wrote:
>>>
>>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
>>>
>>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we update
the install instructions?
>>>
>>> Bret
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bret Pettichord
>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>
>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 16:25:36 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 14:25:36 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>

The only thing that might not work is the IE modal dialog support,
since we've tied into a custom version of win32ole.so, which I've
recompiled from version to version. At this point, it's similar in
nasty scope to recompiling jssh, and worthy of a better solution.
Jarmo, does RAutomation support IE modals? If so, we should replace
the current hacks with that.


Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:55 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
> Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:
>
> = Installation
>
> == Download and Install Ruby
> Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
> ? http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe
>
> == Check Version of RubyGems
> From a command prompt confirm which version of rubygems are installed:
> ? C:\>gem -v
> ? 1.3.7
>
> Update rubygems if required:
> ? C:\>gem update
> ? Updating installed gems
> ? Nothing to update
>
> == [Optional] Installing Behind Authenticating Proxy
> If installing behind an authenticating proxy, first set the HTTP_PROXY
> environment variable:
> ? set HTTP_PROXY=http://username:password at your.proxy.com:80
>
> == Installing Watir 1.7.0
> Install watir:
> ? C:\>gem install watir
>
> [Optional] You can install watir without RDoc and RI (slightly quicker) as
> follows:
> ? C:\>gem install watir --no-ri --no-rdoc
>
> == Quick Shakeout Using IRB
> ? C:\>irb
> ? require 'rubygems'
> ? require 'watir'
> ? browser = Watir::Browser.new
> ? browser.goto("http://bit.ly/watir-example")
>
>
>
> Cheers,
> Tim
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:01 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> 1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although
>> there's not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not mistaken.
>> Jarmo
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the install
>>> instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can cause
>>> confusion straight away.
>>>
>>> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work computer
>>> tomorrow ..
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Tim
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
>>>> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
>>>>
>>>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we update
>>>> the install instructions?
>>>>
>>>> Bret
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Bret Pettichord
>>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>>
>>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From tim.koops at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 16:37:18 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 08:37:18 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=64B_2AKjwpzLwr9cVnz0_qc45BArrM5rsjWFN@mail.gmail.com>

Mistake in my last, omitted the --system flag in gem update

Cheers,
Tim


On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 7:55 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:
>
> *= Installation*
>
> *== Download and Install Ruby*
> Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
>   http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe
>
> *== Check Version of RubyGems*
> From a command prompt confirm which version of rubygems are installed:
>   C:\>gem -v
>   1.3.7
>
> Update rubygems if required:
>   C:\>gem update --system
>   Updating RubyGems
>   Updating rubygems-update
>   Successfully installed rubygems-update-1.4.2
>   Updating RubyGems to 1.4.2
>   Installing RubyGems 1.4.2
>   RubyGems 1.4.2 installed
>
>
>
> *== [Optional] Installing Behind Authenticating Proxy*
> If installing behind an authenticating proxy, first set the HTTP_PROXY
> environment variable:
>   set HTTP_PROXY=http://username:password at your.proxy.com:80
>
> *== Installing Watir 1.7.0*
> Install watir:
>   C:\>gem install watir
>
> [Optional] You can install watir without RDoc and RI (slightly quicker) as
> follows:
>   C:\>gem install watir --no-ri --no-rdoc
>
> *== Quick Shakeout Using IRB*
>   C:\>irb
>   require 'rubygems'
>   require 'watir'
>   browser = Watir::Browser.new
>   browser.goto("http://bit.ly/watir-example")
>
>
>
> Cheers,
> Tim
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:01 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > 1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although
> there's not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not mistaken.
> > Jarmo
> >
> > On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the install
> instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can cause
> confusion straight away.
> >>
> >> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work computer
> tomorrow ..
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Tim
> >>
> >>
> >> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
> >>>
> >>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we update
> the install instructions?
> >>>
> >>> Bret
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Bret Pettichord
> >>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
> >>>
> >>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> >>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Wtr-development mailing list
> >>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wtr-development mailing list
> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sun Jan  9 19:50:28 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 18:50:28 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=FrYc-hYY7YuMT8RUr3tarOAzmRjKOBzfTZd2x@mail.gmail.com>

My recollection is that this requires an earlier version of 1.8.7 before
they switched compilers. I'll track this down further.

Bret

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 3:25 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:

> The only thing that might not work is the IE modal dialog support,
> since we've tied into a custom version of win32ole.so, which I've
> recompiled from version to version. At this point, it's similar in
> nasty scope to recompiling jssh, and worthy of a better solution.
> Jarmo, does RAutomation support IE modals? If so, we should replace
> the current hacks with that.
>
>
> Charley Baker
> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:55 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:
> >
> > = Installation
> >
> > == Download and Install Ruby
> > Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
> >
> http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe
> >
> > == Check Version of RubyGems
> > From a command prompt confirm which version of rubygems are installed:
> >   C:\>gem -v
> >   1.3.7
> >
> > Update rubygems if required:
> >   C:\>gem update
> >   Updating installed gems
> >   Nothing to update
> >
> > == [Optional] Installing Behind Authenticating Proxy
> > If installing behind an authenticating proxy, first set the HTTP_PROXY
> > environment variable:
> >   set HTTP_PROXY=http://username:password at your.proxy.com:80
> >
> > == Installing Watir 1.7.0
> > Install watir:
> >   C:\>gem install watir
> >
> > [Optional] You can install watir without RDoc and RI (slightly quicker)
> as
> > follows:
> >   C:\>gem install watir --no-ri --no-rdoc
> >
> > == Quick Shakeout Using IRB
> >   C:\>irb
> >   require 'rubygems'
> >   require 'watir'
> >   browser = Watir::Browser.new
> >   browser.goto("http://bit.ly/watir-example")
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Tim
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:01 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> 1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although
> >> there's not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not
> mistaken.
> >> Jarmo
> >>
> >> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the
> install
> >>> instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can
> cause
> >>> confusion straight away.
> >>>
> >>> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work
> computer
> >>> tomorrow ..
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> Tim
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
> >>>> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
> >>>>
> >>>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we
> update
> >>>> the install instructions?
> >>>>
> >>>> Bret
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Bret Pettichord
> >>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
> >>>>
> >>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> >>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Wtr-development mailing list
> >>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Wtr-development mailing list
> >>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wtr-development mailing list
> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 02:51:04 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 09:51:04 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>

Hmm, do you have to recompile it for each different Ruby build?

How to verify if something works with modal dialogs or not? I haven't ever
used modal dialogs before...

Jarmo

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 11:25 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:

> The only thing that might not work is the IE modal dialog support,
> since we've tied into a custom version of win32ole.so, which I've
> recompiled from version to version. At this point, it's similar in
> nasty scope to recompiling jssh, and worthy of a better solution.
> Jarmo, does RAutomation support IE modals? If so, we should replace
> the current hacks with that.
>
>
> Charley Baker
> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:55 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:
> >
> > = Installation
> >
> > == Download and Install Ruby
> > Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
> >
> http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe
> >
> > == Check Version of RubyGems
> > From a command prompt confirm which version of rubygems are installed:
> >   C:\>gem -v
> >   1.3.7
> >
> > Update rubygems if required:
> >   C:\>gem update
> >   Updating installed gems
> >   Nothing to update
> >
> > == [Optional] Installing Behind Authenticating Proxy
> > If installing behind an authenticating proxy, first set the HTTP_PROXY
> > environment variable:
> >   set HTTP_PROXY=http://username:password at your.proxy.com:80
> >
> > == Installing Watir 1.7.0
> > Install watir:
> >   C:\>gem install watir
> >
> > [Optional] You can install watir without RDoc and RI (slightly quicker)
> as
> > follows:
> >   C:\>gem install watir --no-ri --no-rdoc
> >
> > == Quick Shakeout Using IRB
> >   C:\>irb
> >   require 'rubygems'
> >   require 'watir'
> >   browser = Watir::Browser.new
> >   browser.goto("http://bit.ly/watir-example")
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Tim
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:01 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> 1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although
> >> there's not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not
> mistaken.
> >> Jarmo
> >>
> >> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the
> install
> >>> instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can
> cause
> >>> confusion straight away.
> >>>
> >>> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work
> computer
> >>> tomorrow ..
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> Tim
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says we
> >>>> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
> >>>>
> >>>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we
> update
> >>>> the install instructions?
> >>>>
> >>>> Bret
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Bret Pettichord
> >>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
> >>>>
> >>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> >>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Wtr-development mailing list
> >>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Wtr-development mailing list
> >>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wtr-development mailing list
> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 02:53:28 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 09:53:28 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinc99+K4=3=4dx7Hn=H5SDnkE_AFErrqiLyOmcJ@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:55 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:
>
> *= Installation*
>
> *== Download and Install Ruby*
> Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
>   http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe


I wouldn't hardcode this download url into instructions, but would rather
use something in the lines of:
"Download latest version of Ruby 1.8.7 or 1.8.6 from
http://rubyinstaller.org/downloads/
Note: Ruby 1.9.x does not work out-of-the-box with Watir, sorry"

Otherwise there might be questions whether p330 is needed and let's say p287
is not working?

Just my observations.

Jarmo
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 03:11:16 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 10:11:16 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir 1.7.1 Released
Message-ID: <AANLkTin0CibJGgVVKcYOk=Z-A-a7LfO5WQ30m16WJnbZ@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everyone!

Just released a new version of Watir - 1.7.1.

This version fixes a bug with Watir::IE.start_process and/or
Watir::IE.new_process. Updating Watir is recommended even if you didn't use
any of these methods.

== Version 1.7.1 - 2011/01/10

=== IE improvements

* Fixed Watir::IE.start_process/new_process. Doesn't completely close
http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472 (Jarmo Pertman)

=== Firefox improvements

- Nothing

Whole Changelog is available at
http://github.com/bret/watir/compare/v1.7.1...v1.7.0

Watir Development Team
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 04:44:00 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 11:44:00 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Reply to WTR-472
Message-ID: <AANLkTimjL3kQYZUG=wKTixns33T6Z4XkTPbNnPkGjvGW@mail.gmail.com>

Replying here to http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472 to avoid offtopic on
JIRA:

Bret wrote:

>> Is there also any reason why window_tests are not included into
core_tests? That's one of the reasons why the problem didn't come out before
the release.

> The reason is simply that the window_tests take over your desktop, so you
can't do anything else while you are running the tests. Whereas the
core_tests do not, so you can check email or whatever while you > are
running them.

> Perhaps we need a standard checklist of tests we should run before a
release so we don't miss something like this again?

I think we shouldn't make any distinction between tests, but should run all
tests with `rake test`, that's because all manual intervention causes
problems like just happened. I don't think that these tests interfere too
much while running, especially since they're not ran 24/7 on your desktop,
but right before needed. My suggestion would be to include all tests into
`rake test` or delete the tests which are not run. The less distinctions,
the better.

> I agree that this warrants a 1.7.1 release ASAP.

Done.


Jarmo
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 10:39:12 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 02:39:12 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>

Hi guys,

I've had a cleanup of instructions at http://watir.com/installation/

Using the format of [Check] Install of Ruby, Update RubyGems, Install Watir
and Install Plugins... I've tailored instructions for each platform, I seem
to use all =)

I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this back to
1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit test for
that?)

Do we plan on not recommending 1.9.x for all distributions or just Windows?

What about watir-webdriver? I'm using that more often these days ...

I've also rejigged a Tips section with using --no-ri --no-rdoc params and
also installing behind an authenticating proxy.

Next I wouldn't mind sinking my teeth into the tailored instructions (more
details) on the Wiki for Ruby and Watir installation issues.

Let me know if the edits are OK on the main installation blog page.

Cheers,
Tim


On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 6:51 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hmm, do you have to recompile it for each different Ruby build?
>
> How to verify if something works with modal dialogs or not? I haven't ever
> used modal dialogs before...
>
> Jarmo
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 11:25 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> The only thing that might not work is the IE modal dialog support,
>> since we've tied into a custom version of win32ole.so, which I've
>> recompiled from version to version. At this point, it's similar in
>> nasty scope to recompiling jssh, and worthy of a better solution.
>> Jarmo, does RAutomation support IE modals? If so, we should replace
>> the current hacks with that.
>>
>>
>> Charley Baker
>> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:55 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Simple instructions for Windows would look like this:
>> >
>> > = Installation
>> >
>> > == Download and Install Ruby
>> > Download and install Ruby 1.8.7-p330 using the default settings from:
>> >
>> http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/73719/rubyinstaller-1.8.7-p330.exe
>> >
>> > == Check Version of RubyGems
>> > From a command prompt confirm which version of rubygems are installed:
>> >   C:\>gem -v
>> >   1.3.7
>> >
>> > Update rubygems if required:
>> >   C:\>gem update
>> >   Updating installed gems
>> >   Nothing to update
>> >
>> > == [Optional] Installing Behind Authenticating Proxy
>> > If installing behind an authenticating proxy, first set the HTTP_PROXY
>> > environment variable:
>> >   set HTTP_PROXY=http://username:password at your.proxy.com:80
>> >
>> > == Installing Watir 1.7.0
>> > Install watir:
>> >   C:\>gem install watir
>> >
>> > [Optional] You can install watir without RDoc and RI (slightly quicker)
>> as
>> > follows:
>> >   C:\>gem install watir --no-ri --no-rdoc
>> >
>> > == Quick Shakeout Using IRB
>> >   C:\>irb
>> >   require 'rubygems'
>> >   require 'watir'
>> >   browser = Watir::Browser.new
>> >   browser.goto("http://bit.ly/watir-example")
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Tim
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 10:01 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> 1.8.7 should be really okay and we should even recommend it although
>> >> there's not any big differences between 1.8.6 and 1.8.7 if i'm not
>> mistaken.
>> >> Jarmo
>> >>
>> >> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 1:18 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I think we should change this, given 1.8.6-26 recommended on the
>> install
>> >>> instructions doesn't even have latesst version of rubygems which can
>> cause
>> >>> confusion straight away.
>> >>>
>> >>> 1.8.7 seems to work well. Happy to document the steps on a work
>> computer
>> >>> tomorrow ..
>> >>>
>> >>> Cheers,
>> >>> Tim
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 9:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I know a lot of us are using Ruby 1.8.7, but our website still says
>> we
>> >>>> recommend Ruby 1.8.6.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Are their known issues that affect some users on 1.8.7 or can we
>> update
>> >>>> the install instructions?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Bret
>> >>>>
>> >>>> --
>> >>>> Bret Pettichord
>> >>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> >>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Wtr-development mailing list
>> >> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Wtr-development mailing list
>> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>> >
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 12:54:40 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 19:54:40 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this back
> to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit test for
> that?)
>

I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure if
that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
figure out the problem itself.

Jarmo
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Mon Jan 10 17:33:09 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 09:33:09 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikUYghpZhrWG2cvb+WWeuR=XFwyFn_GFQ30WccV@mail.gmail.com>

Working on it today...

Cheers,
Tim


On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 4:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this back
>> to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit test for
>> that?)
>>
>
> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure
> if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
> forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
> figure out the problem itself.
>
> Jarmo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Mon Jan 10 21:39:40 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 20:39:40 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>

Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have reminded
me of the state of this.

1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This is C
code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as Ruby. The
version currently distributed with watir works with early versions of 1.8.6.
I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent versions
of 1.8.6.

2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.

3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7 at
Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of Win32Ole
to make it work.

4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.

Bret

On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this back
>> to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit test for
>> that?)
>>
>
> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure
> if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
> forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
> figure out the problem itself.
>
> Jarmo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Mon Jan 10 21:46:39 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 20:46:39 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir 1.7.1 Released
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin0CibJGgVVKcYOk=Z-A-a7LfO5WQ30m16WJnbZ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTin0CibJGgVVKcYOk=Z-A-a7LfO5WQ30m16WJnbZ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=vYN-rb3hVST9U=yrrAcruvt77R2mq=TiQNE5E@mail.gmail.com>

Great turnaround. Thanks!

On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 2:11 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello everyone!
>
> Just released a new version of Watir - 1.7.1.
>
> This version fixes a bug with Watir::IE.start_process and/or
> Watir::IE.new_process. Updating Watir is recommended even if you didn't use
> any of these methods.
>
> == Version 1.7.1 - 2011/01/10
>
> === IE improvements
>
> * Fixed Watir::IE.start_process/new_process. Doesn't completely close
> http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472 (Jarmo Pertman)
>
> === Firefox improvements
>
> - Nothing
>
> Whole Changelog is available at
> http://github.com/bret/watir/compare/v1.7.1...v1.7.0
>
> Watir Development Team
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Mon Jan 10 21:48:37 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 20:48:37 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Reply to WTR-472
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimjL3kQYZUG=wKTixns33T6Z4XkTPbNnPkGjvGW@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimjL3kQYZUG=wKTixns33T6Z4XkTPbNnPkGjvGW@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikpeeSVxQmE5HTrDm=tFxST9oD9tknPL=KvQnuv@mail.gmail.com>

I think it would be great to create a new rake target that runs all the unit
tests that should be run before a release.

Bret

On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 3:44 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Replying here to http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472 to avoid offtopic
> on JIRA:
>
> Bret wrote:
>
> >> Is there also any reason why window_tests are not included into
> core_tests? That's one of the reasons why the problem didn't come out before
> the release.
>
> > The reason is simply that the window_tests take over your desktop, so you
> can't do anything else while you are running the tests. Whereas the
> core_tests do not, so you can check email or whatever while you > are
> running them.
>
> > Perhaps we need a standard checklist of tests we should run before a
> release so we don't miss something like this again?
>
> I think we shouldn't make any distinction between tests, but should run all
> tests with `rake test`, that's because all manual intervention causes
> problems like just happened. I don't think that these tests interfere too
> much while running, especially since they're not ran 24/7 on your desktop,
> but right before needed. My suggestion would be to include all tests into
> `rake test` or delete the tests which are not run. The less distinctions,
> the better.
>
> > I agree that this warrants a 1.7.1 release ASAP.
>
> Done.
>
>
> Jarmo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Tue Jan 11 02:57:03 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 09:57:03 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Reply to WTR-472
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikpeeSVxQmE5HTrDm=tFxST9oD9tknPL=KvQnuv@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimjL3kQYZUG=wKTixns33T6Z4XkTPbNnPkGjvGW@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikpeeSVxQmE5HTrDm=tFxST9oD9tknPL=KvQnuv@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimVMxGLAQj+Wm=WvBCYEOKc+YgJt4NAR2FN-jza@mail.gmail.com>

Not just before release, but just before merging pull request into master
too. That means there is room for an error here and there. Why create that
error? Just because everyone running all tests could read their e-mail for
minute or two?

I'd still suggest not make any distinctions between tests. This just creates
confusion to everyone (to me, to you, to possible contributors and so on)
and a room for errors. People tend to forget and make mistakes. Why even
create that additional possibility when there's enough of these?

As i said, when someone is dealing with some specific thing then he/she can
run only the specific tests and ignore anything else.

Jarmo

On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 4:48 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> I think it would be great to create a new rake target that runs all the
> unit tests that should be run before a release.
>
> Bret
>
> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 3:44 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Replying here to http://jira.openqa.org/browse/WTR-472 to avoid offtopic
>> on JIRA:
>>
>> Bret wrote:
>>
>> >> Is there also any reason why window_tests are not included into
>> core_tests? That's one of the reasons why the problem didn't come out before
>> the release.
>>
>> > The reason is simply that the window_tests take over your desktop, so
>> you can't do anything else while you are running the tests. Whereas the
>> core_tests do not, so you can check email or whatever while you > are
>> running them.
>>
>> > Perhaps we need a standard checklist of tests we should run before a
>> release so we don't miss something like this again?
>>
>> I think we shouldn't make any distinction between tests, but should run
>> all tests with `rake test`, that's because all manual intervention causes
>> problems like just happened. I don't think that these tests interfere too
>> much while running, especially since they're not ran 24/7 on your desktop,
>> but right before needed. My suggestion would be to include all tests into
>> `rake test` or delete the tests which are not run. The less distinctions,
>> the better.
>>
>> > I agree that this warrants a 1.7.1 release ASAP.
>>
>> Done.
>>
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 15:54:05 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 22:54:05 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimTpZZERoakc-NRyLL97Y5Eh6KC4j5nFrgVyenv@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin2v6QZnc_KvvVm7PSZoaAV0S+8E0XiUAH8suG1@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimWvEn=hiZ4OojQg0nbN_ufCBj++BhHWWs3ctjW@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimTpZZERoakc-NRyLL97Y5Eh6KC4j5nFrgVyenv@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimgY=c3iGFSP4q=DzxOi0-VGTQ-xsrjvVepBChA@mail.gmail.com>

I forgot to answer to this e-mail. I'd like if the time would be on Thu and
30 minutes earlier. I cannot participate this week at any time either if
it's still planned though.

Jarmo

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 7:03 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:

> Sorry, I could not make it today, next week same time is fine with me.
>
> Zeljko
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Wed Jan 12 17:25:53 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 16:25:53 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimgY=c3iGFSP4q=DzxOi0-VGTQ-xsrjvVepBChA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin2v6QZnc_KvvVm7PSZoaAV0S+8E0XiUAH8suG1@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimWvEn=hiZ4OojQg0nbN_ufCBj++BhHWWs3ctjW@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimTpZZERoakc-NRyLL97Y5Eh6KC4j5nFrgVyenv@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimgY=c3iGFSP4q=DzxOi0-VGTQ-xsrjvVepBChA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin8GYke-AV9js26Z_tdrCy--9ynsJR9NUjL0a7a@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for the reply. I think i sent a random email to you today. Sorry
about that -- I was flustered and sent it to the wrong person.

Anyway, I don't think we'll have the call this week. Charley can't make this
week no matter when.

But next week would be fine at the time you specified.

Bret


On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:54 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> I forgot to answer to this e-mail. I'd like if the time would be on Thu and
> 30 minutes earlier. I cannot participate this week at any time either if
> it's still planned though.
>
> Jarmo
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 7:03 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
> zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>
>> Sorry, I could not make it today, next week same time is fine with me.
>>
>> Zeljko
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bpettichord at gmail.com  Wed Jan 12 17:29:17 2011
From: bpettichord at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 22:29:17 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20 8:30am
	- 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
Message-ID: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>

You have been invited to the following event.

Title: Watir Dev Standup
When: Thu Jan 20 8:30am ? 9am Central Time
Where: #watir irc channel
Calendar: wtr-development at rubyforge.org
Who:
     * Bret Pettichord - organizer
     * wtr-development at rubyforge.org

Event details:  
https://www.google.com/calendar/event?action=VIEW&eid=ZG4xZjEzbnM5NW83MTdscWRwY3M0aGM3YW8gd3RyLWRldmVsb3BtZW50QHJ1Ynlmb3JnZS5vcmc&tok=MjEjYnBldHRpY2hvcmRAZ21haWwuY29tMmQ5N2E1YTY0NTE1YWI1YTg2MmFmNGE3OGI3NmJkZWFlMWZlMjU5YQ&ctz=America%2FChicago&hl=en

Invitation from Google Calendar: https://www.google.com/calendar/

You are receiving this courtesy email at the account  
wtr-development at rubyforge.org because you are an attendee of this event.

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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Thu Jan 13 06:09:22 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2011 12:09:22 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Watir Dev Standup

Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click in
the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.

?eljko
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Thu Jan 13 22:07:10 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 14:07:10 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>

So I've spent some time today pulling apart the modal_dialog_suite, and
testing against 1.8.7

Surprisingly, most of it works bar 2 exceptions ...

assert_no_modals in test_modal_dialog_use_case_default appears to be an
undefined local variable or method

I also can't click on a button modal1.button(:text, 'Another
Modal').click_no_wait in test_double_modal however the element exists and
can be found in irb etc. The click_no_wait doesn't appear to launch the 2nd
modal.

When you say Win32OLE is patched/hacked, is that the shared object in
C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\1.8\i386-mingw32
or
C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\gems\1.8\gems\watir-1.7.0\lib\watir\win32ole.rb OR
win32ole\win32ole.so ?

If win32ole is the only thing holding us back, why don't we crack on with
the ming compiled version and ditch 1.8.6 altogether?

Cheers,
Tim


On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have reminded
> me of the state of this.
>
> 1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This is C
> code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as Ruby. The
> version currently distributed with watir works with early versions of 1.8.6.
> I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent versions
> of 1.8.6.
>
> 2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
> previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
> only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
> adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.
>
> 3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7 at
> Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of Win32Ole
> to make it work.
>
> 4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.
>
> Bret
>
> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this back
>>> to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit test for
>>> that?)
>>>
>>
>> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure
>> if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
>> forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
>> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
>> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
>> figure out the problem itself.
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Fri Jan 14 06:40:39 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 12:40:39 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir dev standup meeting to be held this
 Friday at 9am CST, 3pm UTC on #watir irc (eom)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinx0nB3Rv2krtxL0Q8LKjCcVJhL6taeHKEmS-or@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimmhNh=sothbtZd=uL0tFqAgDNp93v=63E08jbR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimKUQhMABUZh-FcbYRsBZkBZFuVg+O0g_pXGCfu@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=Xgs0JvJeyjnK1=NL15EEjL_emuyG3K6w64T-L@mail.gmail.com>

 Since I missed the first standup and there is no standup this week, I will
reply inline.

On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 11:52 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
wrote:
> 1. What have you been doing lately for the Watir project?

Recording, editing and publishing podcasts. Blogging at my site and
cross-posting (mine and Jarmo's) blog posts at watir.com. Doing some support
at watir-general and Stack Overflow. Almost there to get free venue for
Watir conference this summer in Zagreb.

> 2. What are you planning to do in the next week?

Publish Watir podcast #41 (maybe even today). Maybe even publish #42. Some
support, of course. Cross post the last Jarmo's blog post (that he prepared)
on watir.com (also maybe even today). Update watir.com with Opera support
(today?).

> 3. What issues are blocking you?

Time. I see _a lot_ of things that should be done, but I have (very) limited
time (and who doesn't). It would be much easier to find the time if I was
payed for it, but I realize we are light years from that (if ever). :)

?eljko
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Fri Jan 14 07:54:10 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 13:54:10 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Updating website with Opera information
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=8iCCMjzfaUT5mpDNFQbHY3Ph1upKmwSaZWUFS@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=8iCCMjzfaUT5mpDNFQbHY3Ph1upKmwSaZWUFS@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=RSq3YPs6zPZsY8SsbnKG_5DZcwtn5t3FOcgLe@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 11:13 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
wrote:
> It doesn't have a photo yet. Could someone put one up, perhaps from here:
> https://github.com/andreastt

Done. Also added Andreas to the map. Oslo is now the only place on Earth
with more than one Watir core member.

> (This page, btw, is a pain to edit. DO NOT user the Wysiwyg editor for
this: it messes up the page.)

Yes. The only way I could get the page to look nice is to use HTML editor.

> I am in the process of adding OperaWatir to the Platforms page as well.

Alister, can you add Opera image back to Supports/Ports section in sidebar?
(I remember we had it there by mistake a year or two ago and then removed
because we did not support Opera back then.)

?eljko
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Fri Jan 14 08:28:31 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 14:28:31 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Podcast #40 Dave McNulla 1/2
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimBU2cikN-d5xXAXkT8PR=e=wi6A55Q78-hZFZz@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTimBU2cikN-d5xXAXkT8PR=e=wi6A55Q78-hZFZz@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin=CdicScHnQUHp2Q7wkvKk6a0LKVABQya4TurL@mail.gmail.com>

And the second and final part:

http://watirpodcast.com/41-dave-mcnulla-2-2/

?eljko
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 12:13:58 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 19:13:58 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>

Oh, crap. I miscalculated. Revert the original time, but leave the day as it
is. Or even better, add 15 minutes to original time. Damn i hate timezones
:/

Jarmo

On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:09 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Watir Dev Standup
>
> Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click in
> the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.
>
> ?eljko
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 12:17:58 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 19:17:58 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=HfQ+DMf8LKFFk9773Z8USHXf0vBbriiCy9jtR@mail.gmail.com>

Did those 2 failing tests work for you with 1.8.6 (i doubt the undefined
local variable worked, for example)? Also, ditching 1.8.6 wouldn't be a good
choice either since it would create a need to upgrade Ruby, which could not
be a user friendly upgrade either.

Jarmo

On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 5:07 AM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> So I've spent some time today pulling apart the modal_dialog_suite, and
> testing against 1.8.7
>
> Surprisingly, most of it works bar 2 exceptions ...
>
> assert_no_modals in test_modal_dialog_use_case_default appears to be an
> undefined local variable or method
>
> I also can't click on a button modal1.button(:text, 'Another
> Modal').click_no_wait in test_double_modal however the element exists and
> can be found in irb etc. The click_no_wait doesn't appear to launch the 2nd
> modal.
>
> When you say Win32OLE is patched/hacked, is that the shared object in
> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\1.8\i386-mingw32
> or
> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\gems\1.8\gems\watir-1.7.0\lib\watir\win32ole.rb OR
> win32ole\win32ole.so ?
>
> If win32ole is the only thing holding us back, why don't we crack on with
> the ming compiled version and ditch 1.8.6 altogether?
>
> Cheers,
> Tim
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have reminded
>> me of the state of this.
>>
>> 1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This is
>> C code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as Ruby.
>> The version currently distributed with watir works with early versions of
>> 1.8.6. I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent
>> versions of 1.8.6.
>>
>> 2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
>> previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
>> only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
>> adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.
>>
>> 3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7 at
>> Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of Win32Ole
>> to make it work.
>>
>> 4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.
>>
>> Bret
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this
>>>> back to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit
>>>> test for that?)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure
>>> if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
>>> forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
>>> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
>>> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
>>> figure out the problem itself.
>>>
>>> Jarmo
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 12:51:13 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 19:51:13 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] activesupport dependency in firewatir
Message-ID: <AANLkTims4dBeMRXAWB3EfCNH424FuNYjztn4OKxo+RnU@mail.gmail.com>

Hello!

I've got recently a direct message from one of the users who was asking
about activesupport dependency in Firewatir. He wanted to know in more
details where and how the dependency is since he doesn't want to ditch rails
3 for that reason. I didn't know for sure and asked him to tweet Charley.

But this makes a valid point - the dependency should be removed ASAP since
otherwise we're not allowing any Rails 3 users to use Firewatir and i'd say
it's real big drawback. I'd propose to mark that issue as a CRTICAL.

Charley, could you deal with this right now or at least share some details
about the situation:
1) Where are actually the dependencies located?
2) How to find out if all dependencies are removed and replaced?
3) Are there tests testing it - e.g. if activesupport is removed, will tests
start to fail so it's possible to fix the code?

Anyway, please let me know if you can deal with it right now or not and if
not then please try to answer the questions above.

Jarmo
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 14:52:06 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 12:52:06 -0700
Subject: [Wtr-development] activesupport dependency in firewatir
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTims4dBeMRXAWB3EfCNH424FuNYjztn4OKxo+RnU@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTims4dBeMRXAWB3EfCNH424FuNYjztn4OKxo+RnU@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinJXxiJOwaKOnnM9+=AYdfxq5b_1aGoH30HHSHV@mail.gmail.com>

I'm flying back home today, and been busy with the conference all week
and my 1/2 day session on Rails on Windows. I will work on it when I
get back. Agreed that this is a priority issue.



Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 10:51 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello!
> I've got recently a direct message from one of the users who was asking
> about activesupport dependency in Firewatir. He wanted to know in more
> details where and how the dependency is since he doesn't want to ditch rails
> 3 for that reason. I didn't know for sure and asked him to tweet Charley.
> But this makes a valid point - the dependency should be removed ASAP since
> otherwise we're not allowing any Rails 3 users to use Firewatir and i'd say
> it's real big drawback. I'd propose to mark that issue as a CRTICAL.
> Charley, could you deal with this right now or at least share some details
> about the situation:
> 1) Where are actually the dependencies located?
> 2) How to find out if all dependencies are removed and replaced?
> 3) Are there tests testing it - e.g. if activesupport is removed, will tests
> start to fail so it's possible to fix the code?
> Anyway, please let me know if you can deal with it right now or not and if
> not then please try to answer the questions above.
> Jarmo
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From bpettichord at gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 18:29:33 2011
From: bpettichord at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 17:29:33 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>

I use this tool to plan international meetings. I can do US time zone math
in my head, but I get confused once I start to cross oceans.
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html

Jarmo, Please use this tool to suggest a new time. I have a meeting at 9:30
am (Central AKA Chicago) every morning that it is important for me to
attend, so I like the idea of having a meeting that is over by then. I can
also meet later in the day.

Also, if you want to be on the invite list, please reply to this email and
include your nearest big city in your time zone that is listed in this
meeting planner (for me Chicago or Houston would work, but Austin is not on
the list). This works better than UTC because (1) Americans don't understand
UTC and (2) neither does any one else.

This is my list so far...

Zeljko, Zagreb
Alister, Brisbane
Jari, ATO, Oslo
Charley, Denver
Jarmo, Talinn

Bret

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:13 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> Oh, crap. I miscalculated. Revert the original time, but leave the day as
> it is. Or even better, add 15 minutes to original time. Damn i hate
> timezones :/
>
> Jarmo
>
> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:09 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
> zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Watir Dev Standup
>>
>> Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click in
>> the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.
>>
>> ?eljko
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>


-- 
Bret Pettichord
Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com

Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bpettichord at gmail.com  Sat Jan 15 18:31:20 2011
From: bpettichord at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 17:31:20 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinX5qC_JN2=pQYLMDf3duGmDpyf3_75A9rZjCLY@mail.gmail.com>

Clarification: the meeting is still open to anyone, even if you are not on
the invite list. the invite is just a way to put a helpful reminder on your
calendar. If someone can suggest a way for me to send an invite to the list
in a way that can be consumed, please let me know.

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 5:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>wrote:

> I use this tool to plan international meetings. I can do US time zone math
> in my head, but I get confused once I start to cross oceans.
> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
>
> Jarmo, Please use this tool to suggest a new time. I have a meeting at 9:30
> am (Central AKA Chicago) every morning that it is important for me to
> attend, so I like the idea of having a meeting that is over by then. I can
> also meet later in the day.
>
> Also, if you want to be on the invite list, please reply to this email and
> include your nearest big city in your time zone that is listed in this
> meeting planner (for me Chicago or Houston would work, but Austin is not on
> the list). This works better than UTC because (1) Americans don't understand
> UTC and (2) neither does any one else.
>
> This is my list so far...
>
> Zeljko, Zagreb
> Alister, Brisbane
> Jari, ATO, Oslo
> Charley, Denver
> Jarmo, Talinn
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:13 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Oh, crap. I miscalculated. Revert the original time, but leave the day as
>> it is. Or even better, add 15 minutes to original time. Damn i hate
>> timezones :/
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:09 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
>> zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> > Watir Dev Standup
>>>
>>> Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click in
>>> the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.
>>>
>>> ?eljko
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>


-- 
Bret Pettichord
Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com

Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From andreastt at opera.com  Sat Jan 15 18:58:59 2011
From: andreastt at opera.com (Andreas Tolf Tolfsen)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 00:58:59 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20110115235859.GC9826@e-tjenesten.org>

* Also sprach Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>:
> Also, if you want to be on the invite list, please reply to this email
> and include your nearest big city in your time zone that is listed in
> this meeting planner (for me Chicago or Houston would work, but Austin
> is not on the list). This works better than UTC because (1)
> Americans don't understand UTC and (2) neither does any one else.

I might be on the list below, but I'd like to make sure I'm on it.  I'd
like to attend.

I'm in Oslo/Berlin (CET, UTC+1).


From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 06:37:31 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 13:37:31 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=tdosgN_AJfSO0ysiCaetr6fzoFgtV3KcHFYSe@mail.gmail.com>

In that case, please set the meeting time to Thu 15:15 UTC. For everyone to
understand what time it is, look at the Bret's suggested url
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=15&sec=0

<http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=00&sec=0>I
guess 15 minutes should be enough.

<http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=00&sec=0>
Jarmo

On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 1:29 AM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>wrote:

> I use this tool to plan international meetings. I can do US time zone math
> in my head, but I get confused once I start to cross oceans.
> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
>
> Jarmo, Please use this tool to suggest a new time. I have a meeting at 9:30
> am (Central AKA Chicago) every morning that it is important for me to
> attend, so I like the idea of having a meeting that is over by then. I can
> also meet later in the day.
>
> Also, if you want to be on the invite list, please reply to this email and
> include your nearest big city in your time zone that is listed in this
> meeting planner (for me Chicago or Houston would work, but Austin is not on
> the list). This works better than UTC because (1) Americans don't understand
> UTC and (2) neither does any one else.
>
> This is my list so far...
>
> Zeljko, Zagreb
> Alister, Brisbane
> Jari, ATO, Oslo
> Charley, Denver
> Jarmo, Talinn
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:13 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Oh, crap. I miscalculated. Revert the original time, but leave the day as
>> it is. Or even better, add 15 minutes to original time. Damn i hate
>> timezones :/
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:09 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
>> zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> > Watir Dev Standup
>>>
>>> Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click in
>>> the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.
>>>
>>> ?eljko
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
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From bpettichord at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 17:43:19 2011
From: bpettichord at gmail.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 16:43:19 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=tdosgN_AJfSO0ysiCaetr6fzoFgtV3KcHFYSe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=tdosgN_AJfSO0ysiCaetr6fzoFgtV3KcHFYSe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimdpURVFRSGf_C=oa2rAT1EiwLY+1jZ6y_b4vyj@mail.gmail.com>

We need at least a half-hour block. We used a full half hour last time and
it would probably be better if we could had some slack afterwards for
followup conversations.

I suggest we go back to the original time.
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingdetails.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=0&sec=0&p1=64&p2=187

Jarmo, if you can only attend part of the meeting, then I understand.

Bret

On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 5:37 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> In that case, please set the meeting time to Thu 15:15 UTC. For everyone to
> understand what time it is, look at the Bret's suggested url
> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=15&sec=0
>
>
> <http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=00&sec=0>I
> guess 15 minutes should be enough.
>
>
> <http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=00&sec=0>
> Jarmo
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 1:29 AM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I use this tool to plan international meetings. I can do US time zone math
>> in my head, but I get confused once I start to cross oceans.
>> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
>>
>> Jarmo, Please use this tool to suggest a new time. I have a meeting at
>> 9:30 am (Central AKA Chicago) every morning that it is important for me to
>> attend, so I like the idea of having a meeting that is over by then. I can
>> also meet later in the day.
>>
>> Also, if you want to be on the invite list, please reply to this email and
>> include your nearest big city in your time zone that is listed in this
>> meeting planner (for me Chicago or Houston would work, but Austin is not on
>> the list). This works better than UTC because (1) Americans don't understand
>> UTC and (2) neither does any one else.
>>
>> This is my list so far...
>>
>> Zeljko, Zagreb
>> Alister, Brisbane
>> Jari, ATO, Oslo
>> Charley, Denver
>> Jarmo, Talinn
>>
>> Bret
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:13 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Oh, crap. I miscalculated. Revert the original time, but leave the day as
>>> it is. Or even better, add 15 minutes to original time. Damn i hate
>>> timezones :/
>>>
>>> Jarmo
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:09 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
>>> zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord <
>>>> bpettichord at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > Watir Dev Standup
>>>>
>>>> Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click
>>>> in the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.
>>>>
>>>> ?eljko
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>


-- 
Bret Pettichord
Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com

Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog <http://www.io.com/%7Ewazmo/blog>
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sun Jan 16 17:55:46 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 16:55:46 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimXP-s6kft3f5tSMLuOTC4X=OitLD9bAK6VK22F@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 9:07 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> When you say Win32OLE is patched/hacked, is that the shared object in
> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\1.8\i386-mingw32
> or
> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\gems\1.8\gems\watir-1.7.0\lib\watir\win32ole.rb OR
> win32ole\win32ole.so ?
>

win32ole.so is compiled from win32ole.c, which has been hacked.
https://github.com/bret/watir/tree/master/watir/lib/watir/win32ole


> If win32ole is the only thing holding us back, why don't we crack on with
> the ming compiled version and ditch 1.8.6 altogether?
>

We also need to make sure that there are no baseline changes to win32ole. If
so, then we would need to migrate the patch to the new version of win32ole
before recompiling.

If we do this we could release the result as 1.8.0. We would need to update
the minor version number as it would change the Ruby requirement, no longer
supporting what we had required previously. While we are at it, maybe would
should pull in some other big changes, like the zero-index code.

As long as we depend on the current approach (hack and recompile win32ole),
we will have a tight binding between Watir (or at least this part of Watir)
and the version of Ruby we've compiled for. The question is whether we want
remove this technical debt.

If we swap out the wrong version of win32ole, it might cause Watir tests to
fail. It could also cause other code using win32ole to fail. We don't have
tests for the latter case.

Bret

On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have reminded
> me of the state of this.
>
> 1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This is C
> code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as Ruby. The
> version currently distributed with watir works with early versions of 1.8.6.
> I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent versions
> of 1.8.6.
>
> 2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
> previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
> only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
> adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.
>
> 3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7 at
> Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of Win32Ole
> to make it work.
>
> 4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.
>
> Bret
>
> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this back
>>> to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit test for
>>> that?)
>>>
>>
>> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure
>> if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
>> forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
>> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
>> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
>> figure out the problem itself.
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>


> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 18:21:27 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 23:21:27 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Invitation: Watir Dev Standup @ Thu Jan 20
 8:30am - 9am (wtr-development@rubyforge.org)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimdpURVFRSGf_C=oa2rAT1EiwLY+1jZ6y_b4vyj@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001485f8944a529c870499adbb79@google.com>
	<AANLkTikfs_UkXK+cya3reEck9iao-aUZUehejkbULrYR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=BsO0At4D-8SAT+FwBTV4oc_u7Hmx9AYnKbwTN@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik9VHq_wSJR6ORwBNBQqQh1NSf7zEpviFUXvcgu@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=tdosgN_AJfSO0ysiCaetr6fzoFgtV3KcHFYSe@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimdpURVFRSGf_C=oa2rAT1EiwLY+1jZ6y_b4vyj@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTineDubD1weja1ExW8-TTrmrRzOBO3k+91OA-T0X@mail.gmail.com>

That time works for me, I'm getting back into it, though the kids are
off again tomorrow with MLK day. :\
Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 10:43 PM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com> wrote:
> We need at least a half-hour block. We used a full half hour last time and
> it would probably be better if we could had some slack afterwards for
> followup conversations.
>
> I suggest we go back to the original time.
> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingdetails.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=0&sec=0&p1=64&p2=187
>
> Jarmo, if you can only attend part of the meeting, then I understand.
>
> Bret
>
> On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 5:37 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> In that case, please set the meeting time to Thu 15:15 UTC. For everyone
>> to understand what time it is, look at the Bret's suggested
>> url?http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?year=2011&month=1&day=20&hour=15&min=15&sec=0
>> I guess 15 minutes should be enough.
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 1:29 AM, Bret Pettichord <bpettichord at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I use this tool to plan international meetings. I can do US time zone
>>> math in my head, but I get confused once I start to cross oceans.
>>> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
>>>
>>> Jarmo, Please use this tool to suggest a new time. I have a meeting at
>>> 9:30 am (Central AKA Chicago) every morning that it is important for me to
>>> attend, so I like the idea of having a meeting that is over by then. I can
>>> also meet later in the day.
>>>
>>> Also, if you want to be on the invite list, please reply to this email
>>> and include your nearest big city in your time zone that is listed in this
>>> meeting planner (for me Chicago or Houston would work, but Austin is not on
>>> the list). This works better than UTC because (1) Americans don't understand
>>> UTC and (2) neither does any one else.
>>>
>>> This is my list so far...
>>>
>>> Zeljko, Zagreb
>>> Alister, Brisbane
>>> Jari, ATO, Oslo
>>> Charley, Denver
>>> Jarmo, Talinn
>>>
>>> Bret
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 11:13 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Oh, crap. I miscalculated. Revert the original time, but leave the day
>>>> as it is. Or even better, add 15 minutes to original time. Damn i hate
>>>> timezones :/
>>>> Jarmo
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 1:09 PM, ?eljko Filipin
>>>> <zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Bret Pettichord
>>>>> <bpettichord at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> > Watir Dev Standup
>>>>>
>>>>> Could you please sent the invitation to me directly? What ever I click
>>>>> in the invitation, it does not show up in my Google Calendar.
>>>>>
>>>>> ?eljko
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bret Pettichord
>>> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>>>
>>> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Lead Developer, Watir, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.io.com/~wazmo/blog
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From basim at baassiri.ca  Sun Jan 16 20:15:45 2011
From: basim at baassiri.ca (Basim Baassiri)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 20:15:45 -0500
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or writing
	tests
Message-ID: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Everyone,

I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.

I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?

I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
current file

What do you use?

Basim
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From alister.scott at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 20:52:49 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 11:52:49 +1000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimXSKXyrHvE=PdLkODiOmNhPfG-n1QhvXGxGMvE@mail.gmail.com>

I have been using RubyMine extensively and exclusively.
Whilst it is paid, some of the benefits include:
* Cross Platform
* Excellent Cucumber support
* Excellent debug support

IMO, it is well worth the small investment.

Cheers,
Alister

Alister Scott
Brisbane, Australia
Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
Blog: http://watirmelon.com
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott

"There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more and
more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*


On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
>
> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
> some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
>
> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>
> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
> EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
> current file
>
> What do you use?
>
> Basim
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From alister.scott at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 20:52:49 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 11:52:49 +1000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimXSKXyrHvE=PdLkODiOmNhPfG-n1QhvXGxGMvE@mail.gmail.com>

I have been using RubyMine extensively and exclusively.
Whilst it is paid, some of the benefits include:
* Cross Platform
* Excellent Cucumber support
* Excellent debug support

IMO, it is well worth the small investment.

Cheers,
Alister

Alister Scott
Brisbane, Australia
Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
Blog: http://watirmelon.com
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott

"There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more and
more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*


On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
>
> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
> some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
>
> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>
> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
> EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
> current file
>
> What do you use?
>
> Basim
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 21:07:50 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 13:07:50 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
	writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <77E4BE5A-C00C-4252-82DA-8149E22CA58A@gmail.com>

vim

Regards,
Tim 



On 17/01/2011, at 12:15 PM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
> 
> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
> 
> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the current file 
> 
> What do you use?
> 
> Basim
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development

From charley.baker at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 21:27:45 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 02:27:45 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTim9aY_VhHvmTDPwfgf_cGcoZKa7Q9VhBt5itTUZ@mail.gmail.com>

Good question. I don't use an IDE, I use vim on Mac/Windows and Linux,
I've spent a lot of time in it and with plugins; it's worth learning.
I do have projects set up and it's fairly easy to jump back and forth
between them. I also use ctags to jump between methods. RubyMine is
also a great project, I've found that Aptana falls a bit behind. I've
also use Notepad++, since I don't need too much aside from a basic
editor. YMMV.


Charley Baker
Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com



On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 1:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
> some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++?called
> EditPlus?which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
> current file
> What do you use?
> Basim
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>

From alister.scott at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 21:41:44 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 12:41:44 +1000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTim9aY_VhHvmTDPwfgf_cGcoZKa7Q9VhBt5itTUZ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim9aY_VhHvmTDPwfgf_cGcoZKa7Q9VhBt5itTUZ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=OhrF7fiRg8cfgH8fSaEK5e0VFjm1YaHJxBwyP@mail.gmail.com>

I also just wrote a blog post about RVM and Bundler: really useful if you
develop on Mac/Linux, or pik/bundler for Windows:

http://watirmelon.com/2011/01/17/easily-manage-your-rubies-with-rvm-bundler-and-pik/

Cheers,

Alister Scott
Brisbane, Australia
Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
Blog: http://watirmelon.com
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott

"There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more and
more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*


On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:27 PM, Charley Baker <charley.baker at gmail.com>wrote:

> Good question. I don't use an IDE, I use vim on Mac/Windows and Linux,
> I've spent a lot of time in it and with plugins; it's worth learning.
> I do have projects set up and it's fairly easy to jump back and forth
> between them. I also use ctags to jump between methods. RubyMine is
> also a great project, I've found that Aptana falls a bit behind. I've
> also use Notepad++, since I don't need too much aside from a basic
> editor. YMMV.
>
>
> Charley Baker
> Lead Developer, Watir, http://watir.com
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 1:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:
> > Hi Everyone,
> > I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
> > some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
> > I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
> > I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
> > EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
> > current file
> > What do you use?
> > Basim
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wtr-development mailing list
> > Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 22:00:42 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 14:00:42 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimXSKXyrHvE=PdLkODiOmNhPfG-n1QhvXGxGMvE@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimXSKXyrHvE=PdLkODiOmNhPfG-n1QhvXGxGMvE@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimZQHwGe9+V0Q-jti3rD4GKPYUHMPNcPsbCqhFw@mail.gmail.com>

I should also add,

Some essential plugins for vim (macvim on mac or gvim on windows)
FuzzyFinder (for files/directories)
http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1984
NerdTree (for a tree based explorer)
http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1658
AutoClose http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1849
Comments http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1528
Endwise http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=2386
Surround http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1697

I also map execution of ruby files to the current file edited with F5 as
such:
nnoremap <silent> <F5> :!ruby %<CR>

Like Charley, I'm still forcing myself to learn different plugins /
shortcuts etc as I enjoy being able to take my .vim directory onto any
platform (osx at home, winxp at work, linux at other client sites etc) and
have a consistent way of doing things ...


Cheers,
Tim


On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:52 PM, Alister Scott <alister.scott at gmail.com>wrote:

> I have been using RubyMine extensively and exclusively.
> Whilst it is paid, some of the benefits include:
> * Cross Platform
> * Excellent Cucumber support
> * Excellent debug support
>
> IMO, it is well worth the small investment.
>
> Cheers,
> Alister
>
> Alister Scott
> Brisbane, Australia
> Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
> Blog: http://watirmelon.com
> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott
>
> "There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more
> and more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>wrote:
>
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
>> some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
>>
>> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>>
>> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
>> EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
>> current file
>>
>> What do you use?
>>
>> Basim
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sun Jan 16 22:30:29 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2011 21:30:29 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimZQHwGe9+V0Q-jti3rD4GKPYUHMPNcPsbCqhFw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimXSKXyrHvE=PdLkODiOmNhPfG-n1QhvXGxGMvE@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimZQHwGe9+V0Q-jti3rD4GKPYUHMPNcPsbCqhFw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin0dg1gu=8j4Fvp70vvR3QS-6Xjd82qJNg9u+ck@mail.gmail.com>

We have standardized on RubyMine at Convio. Me and Hugh and Marek all prefer
it and therefore are pushing it on the rest of our co-workers.

It's support for Cucumber is awesome.

Bret



On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 9:00 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> I should also add,
>
> Some essential plugins for vim (macvim on mac or gvim on windows)
> FuzzyFinder (for files/directories)
> http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1984
> NerdTree (for a tree based explorer)
> http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1658
> AutoClose http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1849
> Comments http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1528
> Endwise http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=2386
> Surround http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1697
>
> I also map execution of ruby files to the current file edited with F5 as
> such:
> nnoremap <silent> <F5> :!ruby %<CR>
>
> Like Charley, I'm still forcing myself to learn different plugins /
> shortcuts etc as I enjoy being able to take my .vim directory onto any
> platform (osx at home, winxp at work, linux at other client sites etc) and
> have a consistent way of doing things ...
>
>
> Cheers,
> Tim
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:52 PM, Alister Scott <alister.scott at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I have been using RubyMine extensively and exclusively.
>> Whilst it is paid, some of the benefits include:
>> * Cross Platform
>> * Excellent Cucumber support
>> * Excellent debug support
>>
>> IMO, it is well worth the small investment.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alister
>>
>> Alister Scott
>> Brisbane, Australia
>> Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
>> Blog: http://watirmelon.com
>> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott
>>
>> "There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more
>> and more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>
>>> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
>>> some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
>>>
>>> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>>>
>>> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
>>> EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
>>> current file
>>>
>>> What do you use?
>>>
>>> Basim
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Sun Jan 16 23:52:07 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 06:52:07 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimXP-s6kft3f5tSMLuOTC4X=OitLD9bAK6VK22F@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimXP-s6kft3f5tSMLuOTC4X=OitLD9bAK6VK22F@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTik8VWKb9YGVKbQQnzXcuhAib5WAaELrx8YaotT_@mail.gmail.com>

I was wondering, do you even have to recompile it for different Ruby
versions, which have same minor version number? At least i have understood
that you only need to recompile binaries if the major or minor version
number differ. E.g. you can use same binary for 1.8.6 and 1.8.7, but need to
recompile it for 1.9.1 and 1.9.2. Am i wrong?

Jarmo

On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:55 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 9:07 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> When you say Win32OLE is patched/hacked, is that the shared object in
>> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\1.8\i386-mingw32
>> or
>> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\gems\1.8\gems\watir-1.7.0\lib\watir\win32ole.rb OR
>> win32ole\win32ole.so ?
>>
>
> win32ole.so is compiled from win32ole.c, which has been hacked.
> https://github.com/bret/watir/tree/master/watir/lib/watir/win32ole
>
>
>> If win32ole is the only thing holding us back, why don't we crack on with
>> the ming compiled version and ditch 1.8.6 altogether?
>>
>
> We also need to make sure that there are no baseline changes to win32ole.
> If so, then we would need to migrate the patch to the new version of
> win32ole before recompiling.
>
> If we do this we could release the result as 1.8.0. We would need to update
> the minor version number as it would change the Ruby requirement, no longer
> supporting what we had required previously. While we are at it, maybe would
> should pull in some other big changes, like the zero-index code.
>
> As long as we depend on the current approach (hack and recompile win32ole),
> we will have a tight binding between Watir (or at least this part of Watir)
> and the version of Ruby we've compiled for. The question is whether we want
> remove this technical debt.
>
> If we swap out the wrong version of win32ole, it might cause Watir tests to
> fail. It could also cause other code using win32ole to fail. We don't have
> tests for the latter case.
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have reminded
>> me of the state of this.
>>
>> 1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This is
>> C code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as Ruby.
>> The version currently distributed with watir works with early versions of
>> 1.8.6. I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent
>> versions of 1.8.6.
>>
>> 2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
>> previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
>> only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
>> adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.
>>
>> 3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7 at
>> Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of Win32Ole
>> to make it work.
>>
>> 4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.
>>
>> Bret
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this
>>>> back to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit
>>>> test for that?)
>>>>
>>>
>>> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not sure
>>> if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test blocks
>>> forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
>>> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
>>> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
>>> figure out the problem itself.
>>>
>>> Jarmo
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From tim.koops at gmail.com  Mon Jan 17 00:20:25 2011
From: tim.koops at gmail.com (Tim Koopmans)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 16:20:25 +1100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik8VWKb9YGVKbQQnzXcuhAib5WAaELrx8YaotT_@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimXP-s6kft3f5tSMLuOTC4X=OitLD9bAK6VK22F@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik8VWKb9YGVKbQQnzXcuhAib5WAaELrx8YaotT_@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=RjjMkatL7z8LfWmuz2e2L115-Aq0Xn=7VzwW0@mail.gmail.com>

That's what I'm thinking, since majority of modal test cases work for me in
1.8.7 ...

Cheers,
Tim


On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:

> I was wondering, do you even have to recompile it for different Ruby
> versions, which have same minor version number? At least i have understood
> that you only need to recompile binaries if the major or minor version
> number differ. E.g. you can use same binary for 1.8.6 and 1.8.7, but need to
> recompile it for 1.9.1 and 1.9.2. Am i wrong?
>
> Jarmo
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:55 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 9:07 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> When you say Win32OLE is patched/hacked, is that the shared object in
>>> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\1.8\i386-mingw32
>>> or
>>> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\gems\1.8\gems\watir-1.7.0\lib\watir\win32ole.rb OR
>>> win32ole\win32ole.so ?
>>>
>>
>> win32ole.so is compiled from win32ole.c, which has been hacked.
>> https://github.com/bret/watir/tree/master/watir/lib/watir/win32ole
>>
>>
>>> If win32ole is the only thing holding us back, why don't we crack on with
>>> the ming compiled version and ditch 1.8.6 altogether?
>>>
>>
>> We also need to make sure that there are no baseline changes to win32ole.
>> If so, then we would need to migrate the patch to the new version of
>> win32ole before recompiling.
>>
>> If we do this we could release the result as 1.8.0. We would need to
>> update the minor version number as it would change the Ruby requirement, no
>> longer supporting what we had required previously. While we are at it, maybe
>> would should pull in some other big changes, like the zero-index code.
>>
>> As long as we depend on the current approach (hack and recompile
>> win32ole), we will have a tight binding between Watir (or at least this part
>> of Watir) and the version of Ruby we've compiled for. The question is
>> whether we want remove this technical debt.
>>
>> If we swap out the wrong version of win32ole, it might cause Watir tests
>> to fail. It could also cause other code using win32ole to fail. We don't
>> have tests for the latter case.
>>
>> Bret
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have
>>> reminded me of the state of this.
>>>
>>> 1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This is
>>> C code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as Ruby.
>>> The version currently distributed with watir works with early versions of
>>> 1.8.6. I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent
>>> versions of 1.8.6.
>>>
>>> 2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
>>> previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
>>> only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
>>> adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.
>>>
>>> 3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7
>>> at Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of
>>> Win32Ole to make it work.
>>>
>>> 4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.
>>>
>>> Bret
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this
>>>>> back to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit
>>>>> test for that?)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not
>>>> sure if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test
>>>> blocks forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
>>>> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
>>>> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
>>>> figure out the problem itself.
>>>>
>>>> Jarmo
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bret Pettichord
>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>
>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From jarmo.p at gmail.com  Mon Jan 17 00:29:02 2011
From: jarmo.p at gmail.com (Jarmo)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:29:02 +0200
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin0dg1gu=8j4Fvp70vvR3QS-6Xjd82qJNg9u+ck@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimXSKXyrHvE=PdLkODiOmNhPfG-n1QhvXGxGMvE@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimZQHwGe9+V0Q-jti3rD4GKPYUHMPNcPsbCqhFw@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin0dg1gu=8j4Fvp70vvR3QS-6Xjd82qJNg9u+ck@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikkAxvD89C2vgV8+N1xEfADy7+Bv9=5kcimO69S@mail.gmail.com>

Glad to see there's so many vim users here. I'm also using it lately. Used
Rubymine before. I have to agree with everyone using vim that it's learning
curve is really steep and it takes a while until you get all your
configuration and plugins into place. But i'm feeling that it's worth it :)

Tim, thank You for Autoclose :)

Here are some of the plugins i'd recommend:
command-t instead of fuzzyfinder https://wincent.com/products/command-t
 <https://wincent.com/products/command-t>vim-matchit
https://github.com/tsaleh/vim-matchit
<https://github.com/tsaleh/vim-matchit>tabbar
http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1338
repeat-vim http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1338

There are many more i'm using, but these are the ones i'd mention in
addition to Tim's recommendations.

Jarmo

On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 5:30 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> We have standardized on RubyMine at Convio. Me and Hugh and Marek all
> prefer it and therefore are pushing it on the rest of our co-workers.
>
> It's support for Cucumber is awesome.
>
> Bret
>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 9:00 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I should also add,
>>
>> Some essential plugins for vim (macvim on mac or gvim on windows)
>> FuzzyFinder (for files/directories)
>> http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1984
>> NerdTree (for a tree based explorer)
>> http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1658
>> AutoClose http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1849
>> Comments http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1528
>> Endwise http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=2386
>> Surround http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=1697
>>
>> I also map execution of ruby files to the current file edited with F5 as
>> such:
>> nnoremap <silent> <F5> :!ruby %<CR>
>>
>> Like Charley, I'm still forcing myself to learn different plugins /
>> shortcuts etc as I enjoy being able to take my .vim directory onto any
>> platform (osx at home, winxp at work, linux at other client sites etc) and
>> have a consistent way of doing things ...
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Tim
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:52 PM, Alister Scott <alister.scott at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> I have been using RubyMine extensively and exclusively.
>>> Whilst it is paid, some of the benefits include:
>>> * Cross Platform
>>> * Excellent Cucumber support
>>> * Excellent debug support
>>>
>>> IMO, it is well worth the small investment.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Alister
>>>
>>> Alister Scott
>>> Brisbane, Australia
>>> Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
>>> Blog: http://watirmelon.com
>>> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott
>>>
>>> "There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more
>>> and more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 11:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>
>>>> I've been following both general and development list for a sometime and
>>>> some of you might of noticed my activity more on the general list.
>>>>
>>>> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>>>>
>>>> I'm on windows and I'm using a text editor similar to Notepad++ called
>>>> EditPlus which allows me to issue a key sequence to run Ruby with the
>>>> current file
>>>>
>>>> What do you use?
>>>>
>>>> Basim
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Mon Jan 17 04:15:34 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 10:15:34 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikS_vdhwAJu8L4tZxwsf2iviDMjzHOFnQ=uWAde@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 2:15 AM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:
> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?

http://netbeans.org/

Cross platform, open source.

?eljko
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From andreastt at opera.com  Mon Jan 17 04:53:46 2011
From: andreastt at opera.com (Andreas Tolf Tolfsen)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 10:53:46 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>

* Also sprach Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>:
> Hi Everyone,

Hello!
  
> I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?

I use Emacs.  It's also free software, by the way.  You should try it
out:

  <http://textmate2.com/>


From bret at pettichord.com  Mon Jan 17 14:14:04 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 13:14:04 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Ruby versions supported
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=RjjMkatL7z8LfWmuz2e2L115-Aq0Xn=7VzwW0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=xUvCp1_XiGswdkyTuZu3pn7k8SO-h5MPmG57+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikuNo897HTGNXL9XLTQr0KJK7KgqJaTsqtnX3jx@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikmtsUFx8D3o3tH78AWHC1eYZ-sWHq+oaiu_eZF@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTim31VG8aQvzg6+-rA2w3Rwub2hX8VaxL+bLtwH7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinJ1y9t2xN-+1JXDh4JydGsu=q2yi=-Qv-vh+UO@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinWcT9Y7DX9OgKJCpbpN66XFtqNRGUnjPUaiwfy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik79z4=Su9mpOLJyW-dVLmPiV+zU0h+ukURbfS+@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinQ4M_ihhtPPLSh7+QxkSGJgaNUmQRALQj5xZk2@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikg_kGXsd99Rk8D55z4m3_-5VezhTKEt6hLbHNk@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin5hryFPenV2LQn1v49yB3PRhtWBCM=d8Vth7Hb@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimXP-s6kft3f5tSMLuOTC4X=OitLD9bAK6VK22F@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik8VWKb9YGVKbQQnzXcuhAib5WAaELrx8YaotT_@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=RjjMkatL7z8LfWmuz2e2L115-Aq0Xn=7VzwW0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin_NC6ie_hq2i7cyzmKyY1z9+_cuHNhdET0OLQr@mail.gmail.com>

There are two scenarios:

1. You need to recompile it when the compiler used by ruby changes.
2. You need to reapply the patch and then recompile whenever changes have
been made to the original win32ole.c code.

I would need to do some research to find out which versions of Ruby have had
one of these two events.

Bret

On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 11:20 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com> wrote:

> That's what I'm thinking, since majority of modal test cases work for me in
> 1.8.7 ...
>
> Cheers,
> Tim
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 3:52 PM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I was wondering, do you even have to recompile it for different Ruby
>> versions, which have same minor version number? At least i have understood
>> that you only need to recompile binaries if the major or minor version
>> number differ. E.g. you can use same binary for 1.8.6 and 1.8.7, but need to
>> recompile it for 1.9.1 and 1.9.2. Am i wrong?
>>
>> Jarmo
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 12:55 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 13, 2011 at 9:07 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> When you say Win32OLE is patched/hacked, is that the shared object in
>>>> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\1.8\i386-mingw32
>>>> or
>>>> C:\ruby187\lib\ruby\gems\1.8\gems\watir-1.7.0\lib\watir\win32ole.rb OR
>>>> win32ole\win32ole.so ?
>>>>
>>>
>>> win32ole.so is compiled from win32ole.c, which has been hacked.
>>> https://github.com/bret/watir/tree/master/watir/lib/watir/win32ole
>>>
>>>
>>>> If win32ole is the only thing holding us back, why don't we crack on
>>>> with the ming compiled version and ditch 1.8.6 altogether?
>>>>
>>>
>>> We also need to make sure that there are no baseline changes to win32ole.
>>> If so, then we would need to migrate the patch to the new version of
>>> win32ole before recompiling.
>>>
>>> If we do this we could release the result as 1.8.0. We would need to
>>> update the minor version number as it would change the Ruby requirement, no
>>> longer supporting what we had required previously. While we are at it, maybe
>>> would should pull in some other big changes, like the zero-index code.
>>>
>>> As long as we depend on the current approach (hack and recompile
>>> win32ole), we will have a tight binding between Watir (or at least this part
>>> of Watir) and the version of Ruby we've compiled for. The question is
>>> whether we want remove this technical debt.
>>>
>>> If we swap out the wrong version of win32ole, it might cause Watir tests
>>> to fail. It could also cause other code using win32ole to fail. We don't
>>> have tests for the latter case.
>>>
>>> Bret
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 1:39 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Charley's comment and a discussion with Hugh McGowan at work have
>>>> reminded me of the state of this.
>>>>
>>>> 1. We actually swap in our own copy of the Ruby Win32OLE library. This
>>>> is C code and therefore needs to be compiled using the same compiler as
>>>> Ruby. The version currently distributed with watir works with early versions
>>>> of 1.8.6. I think they changed to the new compiler (ming) in the most recent
>>>> versions of 1.8.6.
>>>>
>>>> 2. This whole approach is incredibly hacky (it was my idea). I have
>>>> previously suggested that we pull this code (the showModalDialog support
>>>> only) into a separate gem simply because it does these horrible things and
>>>> adds these dependencies that really don't matter to many Watir users.
>>>>
>>>> 3. I was a bit confused, because I know we have some people using 1.8.7
>>>> at Convio, but apparently this is because Hugh hacked the version of
>>>> Win32Ole to make it work.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Yes, Jarmo that is "the" modal dialog test.
>>>>
>>>> Bret
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 11:54 AM, Jarmo <jarmo.p at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jan 10, 2011 at 5:39 PM, Tim Koopmans <tim.koops at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I've recommended 1.8.6 or 1.8.7 of Ruby but thinking of cutting this
>>>>>> back to 1.8.7, pending IE modal dialog support (is there a specific unit
>>>>>> test for that?)
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I found something at unittests\windows\modal_dialog_test.rb. I'm not
>>>>> sure if that is THE modal dialog, but it seems to be. For me that test
>>>>> blocks forever under Win7/XP with 1.8.6 and 1.8.7. Haven't had any time to
>>>>> investigate as to why is that happening. Maybe someone else can try that
>>>>> test on their machine too to see if there's any difference and maybe even
>>>>> figure out the problem itself.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jarmo
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Bret Pettichord
>>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>>
>>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bret Pettichord
>>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>>
>>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Tue Jan 18 04:26:42 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 10:26:42 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] =?utf-8?q?Selenium_Conf_is_coming=E2=80=A6_get_?=
	=?utf-8?q?your_proposals_in!?=
Message-ID: <AANLkTinnuxfPBRvdDD7HoxAWYpmjUW69tGrvW9JKTBVD@mail.gmail.com>

Talk submission dedline is Friday, January 21, 2011 11:59 PM (Pacific
Standard Time).

More information:

http://seleniumhq.wordpress.com/2011/01/17/selenium-conf-is-coming-get-your-proposals-in/

?eljko
--
watir.com - community manager
watirpodcast.com - host
testingpodcast.com - audio podcasts on software testing. all of them
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Tue Jan 18 11:13:15 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 17:13:15 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Updating website with Opera information
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=RSq3YPs6zPZsY8SsbnKG_5DZcwtn5t3FOcgLe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=8iCCMjzfaUT5mpDNFQbHY3Ph1upKmwSaZWUFS@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=RSq3YPs6zPZsY8SsbnKG_5DZcwtn5t3FOcgLe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimC1=9gjvSDeuA0WGpqGRatviRCv_5O5ANW08Y3@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 1:54 PM, ?eljko Filipin <
zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
> Alister, can you add Opera image back to Supports/Ports section in
sidebar?

Done.

?eljko
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Wed Jan 19 06:45:01 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 12:45:01 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>

A few of us from the Watir Team[1] were chatting about making process of
getting into the team more transparent. For now we just do whatever we like.
:)

Things to do:

1) I have seen other projects have a vote (+1, -1, ~1) at their development
list. I think that is enough and makes it transparent. Agree?
2) We have recently added Andreas to the team. If we agree on 1) we will
have a vote on that soon.
3) I would even like a voting for existing members, so we get (or lose)
credibility. After we see how 2) goes.
4) I would like to move a few people to alumni section. How do we decide
when to move somebody there? No (significant) contributions in past 6/12
months? (I would like to make it clear that moving to alumni section is not
a punishment, but a reflection of the current state. It is easy to move back
to active contributors, if the person becomes active again. Of course, we
would vote here about that.)

Let me know what you think.

--
[1] http://watir.com/team/


?eljko
--
watir.com - community manager
watirpodcast.com - host
testingpodcast.com - audio podcasts on software testing. all of them
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From jari.bakken at gmail.com  Wed Jan 19 07:28:39 2011
From: jari.bakken at gmail.com (Jari Bakken)
Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 13:28:39 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=kh7MQB1g=SMZKWGQghbKBnGFM08QbjGNKgv_r@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 12:45 PM, ?eljko Filipin
<zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>
> 1) I have seen other projects have a vote (+1, -1, ~1) at their development
> list. I think that is enough and makes it transparent. Agree?

+1

> 2) We have recently added Andreas to the team. If we agree on 1) we will
> have a vote on that soon.

+1

> 3) I would even like a voting for existing members, so we get (or lose)
> credibility. After we see how 2) goes.

~1

> 4) I would like to move a few people to alumni section. How do we decide
> when to move somebody there? No (significant) contributions in past 6/12
> months? (I would like to make it clear that moving to alumni section is not
> a punishment, but a reflection of the current state. It is easy to move back
> to active contributors, if the person becomes active again. Of course, we
> would vote here about that.)

~1

From bret at pettichord.com  Wed Jan 19 19:59:26 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 18:59:26 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 5:45 AM, ?eljko Filipin <
zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:

> A few of us from the Watir Team[1] were chatting about making process of
> getting into the team more transparent. For now we just do whatever we like.
> :)
>
> Things to do:
>
> 1) I have seen other projects have a vote (+1, -1, ~1) at their development
> list. I think that is enough and makes it transparent. Agree?
>

Not sure I understand "~1". I thought it was +0. But then I still use paper
for my todo list, so I am old-fashioned.

One of the things that makes this complicated is that this is not a simple
team. We have people who run watir.com, people who commit code, people who
run our mailing lists. In these cases, we give them certain permissions to
do these things. There is also recognition of what certain people do....


> 2) We have recently added Andreas to the team. If we agree on 1) we will
> have a vote on that soon.
>

I suggested that we add Andreas to the team page on Watir.com, so I am of
course +1 on this.

3) I would even like a voting for existing members, so we get (or lose)
> credibility. After we see how 2) goes.
>

Well, I think this might be a reference to the fact that I recently,
privately suggested we give Tim editor rights to Watir.com. Although we have
already done that, I don't mind putting that question to a vote. I am of
course +1 on this issue.

This also makes me think that there should be a clear understanding that the
Watir team does in fact have the right to vote me off the island if you all
so wanted to. I would respect the decision of the team.


> 4) I would like to move a few people to alumni section. How do we decide
> when to move somebody there? No (significant) contributions in past 6/12
> months? (I would like to make it clear that moving to alumni section is not
> a punishment, but a reflection of the current state. It is easy to move back
> to active contributors, if the person becomes active again. Of course, we
> would vote here about that.)
>

I have periodically done this in the past, but there has not really been a
protocol. I think it is important for us to recognize who the active members
of the Watir team are. This respects their contributions and also helps our
users have a better understanding about who is really doing the work
currently. We owe this to our user community.

My general feeling is that someone who has not made a significant
contribution to the team for a year should no longer be considered part of
the active team. There are certainly things that come up -- releases,
illnesses, vacations, babies, job transitions -- that may make us unable to
contribute for months. I guess it would be best if people who no longer
consider themselves part of the active team were to nominate themselves for
the alumni list.

Bret

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From basim at baassiri.ca  Thu Jan 20 20:45:27 2011
From: basim at baassiri.ca (Basim Baassiri)
Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2011 20:45:27 -0500
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinQt-sETHejKPhh-t06MxhNFYiK-GH5knB+bMUV@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks everyone for your input

Cheers

Basim

On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 4:53 AM, Andreas Tolf Tolfsen
<andreastt at opera.com>wrote:

> * Also sprach Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>:
> > Hi Everyone,
>
> Hello!
>
> > I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>
> I use Emacs.  It's also free software, by the way.  You should try it
> out:
>
>  <http://textmate2.com/>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Thu Jan 20 21:02:31 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2011 20:02:31 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] oops
Message-ID: <AANLkTik7ntFc45h5M-PAd9g7BfRpTbwxXhN0FwZJVU0e@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry i missed the meeting on irc today. I've been busy at work lately,
trying to rush out a new release to fix some big problems for a big client.
I made the call that the project was no longer on track after the discovery
of complicated and critical bug today. Anyway, very busy with that.

Also making arrangements for SeConf. I've been asked to give a keynote and
have been thinking a lot about what that should be. Debating between hosting
a Selenium History Fishbowl and giving some long rambling talk on Mercury
and Watir and Selenium and The Future of Testing. Also getting side
communications from a number of people on the selenium team that make me
feel like they want me to help sort out things with Selenium. Do I want to
do that?

In addition to forgetting about the meeting that I planned and scheduled, I
also forgot to put my mac to sleep. It happened to have an open chat window
to #watir, so I did end up with a full transcript of of the chat. I see that
I need to schedule some follow conversations:

Charley - Watir Day at SeConf - San Francisco - April

My boss is excited about SeConf and wants to come himself and also bring
Hugh and Marek J. We have an office in Berkeley (moving to Emeryville, i
think) that we will visit after the conference.

Zeljko - Watir Days in Croatia - June

I sent private mail already. Short version: I think it will be my mom and my
13 year old daughter travelling with me. No dates set but I added your dates
to my calendar. My son (25) might be in Vienna this summer. I'm waiting to
find out when this might be.

If you are reading this and thinking that you might come, could you please
send a note to Zeljko. Dates are around June 14-16.

I am glad to hear technical progress from ato, jarib and


My technical backlog:
- Improve framework support for Cucumber at Convio
- Finish zero-index feature for Watir
- Draft Roadmap for Watir
- Making Watir API easier to use with frameworks (e.g. see
https://github.com/bret/watircraft/blob/master/lib/extensions/watir.rb )

However, no progress on any of this in the recent past or likely in the next
week or three.

I also forgot to recharge my phone last night, which is why it didn't remind
me of the standup meeting.

Bret

-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From bret at pettichord.com  Thu Jan 20 21:04:29 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2011 20:04:29 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinQt-sETHejKPhh-t06MxhNFYiK-GH5knB+bMUV@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>
	<AANLkTinQt-sETHejKPhh-t06MxhNFYiK-GH5knB+bMUV@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin69YCX0uRy2xxsD16V-i0tQf8C4xOq5B9ATuyw@mail.gmail.com>

If someone has the time, summarizing the replies on this thread would make a
good blog post, perhaps for Watir.com.

Bret

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 7:45 PM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:

> Thanks everyone for your input
>
> Cheers
>
> Basim
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 4:53 AM, Andreas Tolf Tolfsen <andreastt at opera.com
> > wrote:
>
>> * Also sprach Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>:
>> > Hi Everyone,
>>
>> Hello!
>>
>> > I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>>
>> I use Emacs.  It's also free software, by the way.  You should try it
>> out:
>>
>>  <http://textmate2.com/>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Fri Jan 21 06:43:22 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 12:43:22 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinaP1RYjFm8WRyExpAHPL4UeaU42H8JQ0MngXtG@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 1:59 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
wrote:
> Not sure I understand "~1". I thought it was +0. But then I still use
paper for my todo list, so I am old-fashioned.

I think I saw ~1 on selenium-dev list.

> One of the things that makes this complicated is that this is not a simple
team.

Watir project is not a simple thing any more. :) A few years ago Watir was
just IE driver, but now it is several drivers and watirspec. Each of them is
a separate project. It got confusing. Watir.com is our attempt to make sense
of all that.

> I suggested that we add Andreas to the team page on Watir.com, so I am of
course +1 on this.

I am +1 too, I just wanted to make it transparent.

> Well, I think this might be a reference to the fact that I recently,
privately suggested we give Tim editor rights to Watir.com.

I am not sure if I understood you. I do not propose that we should vote for
every single thing. If somebody needs some privileges to do some work, my
policy so far was "It's easier to ask forgiveness than it is to get
permission"[1]. I just wanted to see if people think we should vote for
adding people to the Watir team.

> This also makes me think that there should be a clear understanding that
the Watir team does in fact have the right to vote me off the island if you
all so wanted to.

I do not think we ever removed somebody from the team. Only moved to alumni
section if they are no longer active.

> I guess it would be best if people who no longer consider themselves part
of the active team were to nominate themselves for the alumni list.

I do not think that will happen. People that are no longer active usually do
not care if they are in a team. :)

?eljko
--
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Hopper#Notable_quotation
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From simon.m.stewart at gmail.com  Fri Jan 21 06:50:54 2011
From: simon.m.stewart at gmail.com (Simon Stewart)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 11:50:54 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinaP1RYjFm8WRyExpAHPL4UeaU42H8JQ0MngXtG@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinaP1RYjFm8WRyExpAHPL4UeaU42H8JQ0MngXtG@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin3oqX6DC9rhhHPZtQ0sics4mYkY+EiEzy0KLWR@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:43 AM, ?eljko Filipin
<zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 1:59 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> wrote:
>> Not sure I understand "~1". I thought it was +0. But then I still use
>> paper for my todo list, so I am old-fashioned.
>
> I think I saw ~1 on selenium-dev list.

That's what we do: +1, -1 and ~1. I think I prefer ~1 to +0 since it
indicates a commitment and I can just total up the symbols rather than
the numbers, but that's a rationalization :)

Simon

From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Fri Jan 21 08:30:26 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 14:30:26 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] oops
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik7ntFc45h5M-PAd9g7BfRpTbwxXhN0FwZJVU0e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTik7ntFc45h5M-PAd9g7BfRpTbwxXhN0FwZJVU0e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTin+rJEZ9iTTCzDrnnpdNowjEqR0B8hTcko=JZue@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 3:02 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
wrote:
> Zeljko - Watir Days in Croatia - June
> If you are reading this and thinking that you might come, could you please
send a note to Zeljko. Dates are around June 14-16.

Please do let me know. We got free venue for 3 days, one of them (the first
or the last) will be Viaqa[1] (local software testing conference) and the
remaining two days would be Watir conference.

You are welcome to both. Viaqa will happen 99%, Watir conference only if
there is interest in it.

?eljko
--
[1] http://viaqa.mobi/
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From bret at pettichord.com  Fri Jan 21 20:06:05 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 19:06:05 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin3oqX6DC9rhhHPZtQ0sics4mYkY+EiEzy0KLWR@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinaP1RYjFm8WRyExpAHPL4UeaU42H8JQ0MngXtG@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin3oqX6DC9rhhHPZtQ0sics4mYkY+EiEzy0KLWR@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimUkYzjRDz_i=p5+MrNyykeww90ULSk_CyAfxAq@mail.gmail.com>

It sounds to me like people who have degrees in computer science came up
with the ~1 thing. My degree is in mathematics, so that makes me a lot more
conservative about adding new forms of notation.

Maybe we should use -0 to indicate when there is also a lack of commitment?

Bret

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 5:50 AM, Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com>wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:43 AM, ?eljko Filipin
> <zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
> > On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 1:59 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
> > wrote:
> >> Not sure I understand "~1". I thought it was +0. But then I still use
> >> paper for my todo list, so I am old-fashioned.
> >
> > I think I saw ~1 on selenium-dev list.
>
> That's what we do: +1, -1 and ~1. I think I prefer ~1 to +0 since it
> indicates a commitment and I can just total up the symbols rather than
> the numbers, but that's a rationalization :)
>
> Simon
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From alister.scott at gmail.com  Fri Jan 21 23:40:01 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 14:40:01 +1000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimUkYzjRDz_i=p5+MrNyykeww90ULSk_CyAfxAq@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinaP1RYjFm8WRyExpAHPL4UeaU42H8JQ0MngXtG@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin3oqX6DC9rhhHPZtQ0sics4mYkY+EiEzy0KLWR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimUkYzjRDz_i=p5+MrNyykeww90ULSk_CyAfxAq@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=v57VKP2ZEt0azgKo_wokMgZYcpaA5Dmh5HLMe@mail.gmail.com>

@Bret: I could have sworn your degree was in linguistics

Alister Scott
Brisbane, Australia
Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
Blog: http://watirmelon.com
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott

"There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more and
more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*


On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 11:06 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> It sounds to me like people who have degrees in computer science came up
> with the ~1 thing. My degree is in mathematics, so that makes me a lot more
> conservative about adding new forms of notation.
>
> Maybe we should use -0 to indicate when there is also a lack of commitment?
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 5:50 AM, Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:43 AM, ?eljko Filipin
>> <zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>> > On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 1:59 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >> Not sure I understand "~1". I thought it was +0. But then I still use
>> >> paper for my todo list, so I am old-fashioned.
>> >
>> > I think I saw ~1 on selenium-dev list.
>>
>> That's what we do: +1, -1 and ~1. I think I prefer ~1 to +0 since it
>> indicates a commitment and I can just total up the symbols rather than
>> the numbers, but that's a rationalization :)
>>
>> Simon
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From bret at pettichord.com  Sat Jan 22 01:30:56 2011
From: bret at pettichord.com (Bret Pettichord)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 00:30:56 -0600
Subject: [Wtr-development] Watir Team
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=v57VKP2ZEt0azgKo_wokMgZYcpaA5Dmh5HLMe@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=5_DE=UMvvqFtE1tOHM=rD+GWf4sp=-y7eqfqh@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTikNUKiBcXOVqL+kKGXOW6k3f9xNZm0v+cpR5mKd@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinaP1RYjFm8WRyExpAHPL4UeaU42H8JQ0MngXtG@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin3oqX6DC9rhhHPZtQ0sics4mYkY+EiEzy0KLWR@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimUkYzjRDz_i=p5+MrNyykeww90ULSk_CyAfxAq@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTi=v57VKP2ZEt0azgKo_wokMgZYcpaA5Dmh5HLMe@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTim=+rhjZ2GyNtf-MddhQ2MkpJ7zt-YjCOCkP4xw@mail.gmail.com>

I have a bachelor's degree in philosophy and mathematics. I did read a lot
of linguistic philosophy including Wittgenstein, Austin, Rorty and Derrida.

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 10:40 PM, Alister Scott <alister.scott at gmail.com>wrote:

> @Bret: I could have sworn your degree was in linguistics
>
> Alister Scott
> Brisbane, Australia
> Watir Web Master: http://watir.com
> Blog: http://watirmelon.com
> LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/alisterscott
>
> "There are two ways to get enough: One is to continue to accumulate more
> and more. The other is to desire less." *~ G. K. Chesterton*
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 11:06 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:
>
>> It sounds to me like people who have degrees in computer science came up
>> with the ~1 thing. My degree is in mathematics, so that makes me a lot more
>> conservative about adding new forms of notation.
>>
>> Maybe we should use -0 to indicate when there is also a lack of
>> commitment?
>>
>> Bret
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 5:50 AM, Simon Stewart <simon.m.stewart at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 11:43 AM, ?eljko Filipin
>>> <zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
>>> > On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 1:59 AM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >> Not sure I understand "~1". I thought it was +0. But then I still use
>>> >> paper for my todo list, so I am old-fashioned.
>>> >
>>> > I think I saw ~1 on selenium-dev list.
>>>
>>> That's what we do: +1, -1 and ~1. I think I prefer ~1 to +0 since it
>>> indicates a commitment and I can just total up the symbols rather than
>>> the numbers, but that's a rationalization :)
>>>
>>> Simon
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bret Pettichord
>> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>>
>> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
>> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>



-- 
Bret Pettichord
Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com

Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Tue Jan 25 04:43:47 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 10:43:47 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Google Summer of CodeTM 2011
Message-ID: <AANLkTikRYTRwUwpFOWG7ri1hcjTT3n+Wf-uD495h2qFt@mail.gmail.com>

Are we going to participate this year?

http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/program/home/google/gsoc2011

?eljko
--
watir.com - community manager
watirpodcast.com - host
testingpodcast.com - audio podcasts on software testing. all of them
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From alister.scott at gmail.com  Sun Jan 30 05:36:55 2011
From: alister.scott at gmail.com (Alister Scott)
Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2011 20:36:55 +1000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTin69YCX0uRy2xxsD16V-i0tQf8C4xOq5B9ATuyw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>
	<AANLkTinQt-sETHejKPhh-t06MxhNFYiK-GH5knB+bMUV@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin69YCX0uRy2xxsD16V-i0tQf8C4xOq5B9ATuyw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTing-3ujiXEx30BzvVa4KtnHMCRkpdFk-FNvXuYy@mail.gmail.com>

FYI: RubyMine is on sale for $29 until 15 Feb: http://wp.me/p98zF-cX

Cheers,
Alister

On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 12:04 PM, Bret Pettichord <bret at pettichord.com>wrote:

> If someone has the time, summarizing the replies on this thread would make
> a good blog post, perhaps for Watir.com.
>
> Bret
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 7:45 PM, Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca> wrote:
>
>> Thanks everyone for your input
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Basim
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 17, 2011 at 4:53 AM, Andreas Tolf Tolfsen <
>> andreastt at opera.com> wrote:
>>
>>> * Also sprach Basim Baassiri <basim at baassiri.ca>:
>>> > Hi Everyone,
>>>
>>> Hello!
>>>
>>> > I have a question to everyone as to what IDE they use ?
>>>
>>> I use Emacs.  It's also free software, by the way.  You should try it
>>> out:
>>>
>>>  <http://textmate2.com/>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wtr-development mailing list
>>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wtr-development mailing list
>> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Bret Pettichord
> Director, Watir Project, www.watir.com
>
> Blog, www.testingwithvision.com
> Twitter, www.twitter.com/bpettichord
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>
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From zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch  Mon Jan 31 05:11:49 2011
From: zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch (=?UTF-8?Q?=C5=BDeljko_Filipin?=)
Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2011 11:11:49 +0100
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTing-3ujiXEx30BzvVa4KtnHMCRkpdFk-FNvXuYy@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>
	<AANLkTinQt-sETHejKPhh-t06MxhNFYiK-GH5knB+bMUV@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin69YCX0uRy2xxsD16V-i0tQf8C4xOq5B9ATuyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTing-3ujiXEx30BzvVa4KtnHMCRkpdFk-FNvXuYy@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinDEjdK9FO+p8ORdnnAp8zuLnq0Grog8xKB0hLF@mail.gmail.com>

Looks like I will have to move to another IDE/editor soon:

http://www.infoq.com/news/2011/01/ruby-dropped-in-netbeans-7

?eljko
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From charley.baker at gmail.com  Mon Jan 31 13:28:47 2011
From: charley.baker at gmail.com (Charley Baker)
Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2011 18:28:47 +0000
Subject: [Wtr-development] Preferred IDE for developing watir and/or
 writing tests
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinDEjdK9FO+p8ORdnnAp8zuLnq0Grog8xKB0hLF@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTinOjj3pWXxdV4+DZULYVuu-TMp9yV+WYf7iQp7T@mail.gmail.com>
	<20110117095346.GE9826@e-tjenesten.org>
	<AANLkTinQt-sETHejKPhh-t06MxhNFYiK-GH5knB+bMUV@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTin69YCX0uRy2xxsD16V-i0tQf8C4xOq5B9ATuyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTing-3ujiXEx30BzvVa4KtnHMCRkpdFk-FNvXuYy@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTinDEjdK9FO+p8ORdnnAp8zuLnq0Grog8xKB0hLF@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimE5nSQgFgZ7MB3FMoqrRLxgD-+K++yk_2-BzWn@mail.gmail.com>

Rubymine is $29 for the next few weeks due to NB dropping support for
Ruby. It's a really solid IDE and well worth the money. Redcar also
looks interesting.


-c


On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 10:11 AM, ?eljko Filipin
<zeljko.filipin at wa-research.ch> wrote:
> Looks like I will have to move to another IDE/editor soon:
>
> http://www.infoq.com/news/2011/01/ruby-dropped-in-netbeans-7
>
> ?eljko
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wtr-development mailing list
> Wtr-development at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/wtr-development
>